An interesting Conversation with Pacific Fresh (forum)

sternus1 starts with ...
So I spoke to somebody from pacific fresh today, who told me that Dekopon will 'Absolutely no doubt' be licensed out as tree sales in the future.

However, they also 'Don't know when' and they have 'no immediate plans' to do this.

so There you go people. It's coming, someday.

s

Time: 23rd April 2014 1:57pm

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About the Author sternus1
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JohnMc1 says...
Well you've managed to extract an extra small morsel of info out of them than I could.
we'll see which comes first, as the saying goes, I have.... ~stretching the truth a little bit, maybe 4 to ~7yrs to go.
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Time: 23rd April 2014 2:25pm

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sternus1 says...
I reckon closer to 4 than 7 John, judging by the size and condition of your plants. Citrus grows to fruiting stage faster than a lot of things from seed, and it's down the nature of the beast after all. You make me wish I'd planted some seed!

I was pretty sure that pacific fresh would license out the dekopon, just way too lucrative not to. Had some free time today, found the company phone number and thought why not. I got the feeling from the person I spoke to that I wasn't the first to call and ask.

Time: 23rd April 2014 2:43pm

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About the Author sternus1
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JohnMc1 says...
Yes, I'm growing them in a soilless mix with a weak amount of hydroponic solution added to every watering. They get a regular rest while excess salt is flushed out, then back to force feeding. Might have to slow up now the nights are cooling off. They're only 8 months old from the day I planted the seed.

Time: 23rd April 2014 5:35pm

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BJ says...
I'd imagine they are looking for a decent financial return on their investment by cornering the market for a few years, then when the cat is out of the bag (seedlings nearing fruiting stage and the sharing of material becoming inevitable) move to distributing grafted plants.

Time: 23rd April 2014 8:47pm

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About the Author Theposterformerlyknownas
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Brain says...
I would be most curious to see how long it takes from seed to fruit. But by the sound of things, JohnMc might be on his path to set a new record! good on you!

I'm going to place a bet for 3 years (including the 8 mths). So by some time in Aug 2016.


Time: 23rd April 2014 11:06pm

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Original Post was last edited: 23rd April 2014 11:05pm

About the Author Brain
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Boris Spasky says...
I'm more interested in tasting the first commercial crop of Gold Nugget mandarins later this season.
A late variety, developed in California and seedless.
From UCR,
"The taste is extremely sweet when mature (brix 15.0% in March, 17.5% in May) with a very rich flavor, considered by professional taste panels to be one of the very best flavored citrus in the world."
Hope it lives up to the hype.

Time: 23rd April 2014 11:49pm

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JohnMc1 says...
Yes, there's a lot of hype over the Sumo's as well. I'm sure they all taste amazing straight off the tree, but lose their mojo very quickly, or they're not moving them from paddock to plate quick enough, not sure which one. I bought $50 worth of Sumo's last year, I think for around $8kg, and some were pretty ordinary. I ended up with about 8 seeds with half having multi embryos.
I carefully separated the secondary shoots as they come up and are growing them on separately.
There are other people that have at least a year's head start on me, I'd like to see how their seedlings are coming along, last season was my first access to the fruit.

Time: 24th April 2014 8:19am

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About the Author JohnMc1
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sean says...
Hi John, You have done a fantastic job getting those seedlings to that size so quickly. Have you considered grafting them onto an established Citrus tree? You should have fruit in no time doing that.
Also I noticed that one of your seedlings is a bit thorny, do you think that one is possibly not a clone?

Time: 2nd September 2014 4:43am

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About the Author sean
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David says...
Woolworths at Carindale are currently selling the Sumo Mandies at a crazy price and believe me a very ordinary taste to boot, not worth it IMO.

Time: 2nd September 2014 6:03am

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sean says...
Really, I can't get enough of them, very sweet with a really zingy taste, you must have got a bad batch.


Time: 2nd September 2014 7:01am

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About the Author sean
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jakfruit etiquette says...
If you investigate the growing regime used by Japanese Dekopon(Sumo) farmers, they have pretty strict targets for brix and fruit quality for fruit marketed as "Dekopon".

Time: 2nd September 2014 7:05am

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JohnMc1 says...
QUOTE
"sean says...
Hi John, You have done a fantastic job getting those seedlings to that size so quickly. Have you considered grafting them onto an established Citrus tree? You should have fruit in no time doing that. "

sean, I have six trifoliata rootstocks ready to go. I'll be bud grafting Sumo onto them this December.
From what I've read, I don't think it's going to speed up the process, there is a time/cycle regime the buds must endure before they will fruit.
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Time: 2nd September 2014 9:54pm

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Brain says...
I will also have to make a trip and get some sumos. I must admit, the japanese type mandarins are a bit of an acquired taste for me, but the novelty is there and it would be great to have your own tree.

Time: 2nd September 2014 9:59pm

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jakfruit etiquette says...
In general it is not thought that grafting(etc) Citrus seedlings onto rootstock alone promotes flowering. Grafting onto large rootstocks or reworking onto an established tree will cause rapid growth and size increase, so that the seedling scion reaches fruiting size quickly. That said, if grafting onto rootstock promotes growth rate, it will shorten time to flowering. In my experience grafting onto rootstock has caused flowering before the original seedling flowered, but as Citrus are complex hybrids of ancestral species, it may not work for all varieties.
If you are working with unique seedlings i would graft them onto rootstocks, as multiple copies are handy in case the original dies.

Time: 3rd September 2014 6:47am

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JohnMc1 says...
QUOTE/
"jakfruit etiquette says...
If you investigate the growing regime used by Japanese Dekopon(Sumo) farmers, they have pretty strict targets for brix and fruit quality for fruit marketed as "Dekopon". /END QUOTE

Apparently they store the fruit from 20 to 40 days after picking for the acid levels to drop and the brix to rise? Some fruit I've tried still had high acid levels for my taste. I should go get another couple of kilo's and gradually consume them over several weeks to see if the acid level drops further.

Time: 3rd September 2014 7:20am

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Boris Spasky says...
If acid levels are persistently high even after cool storing, then trifoliata may not be the best rootstock to bud on.
How many could you cool store in your fridge--not many!

Time: 3rd September 2014 10:05am

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JohnMc1 says...
What do you suggest? I only have the choice of Tri, rough lemon or one flying dragon. Most will be grown on as seedlings, as I saw recently with a commercially sold lemon cv.

Time: 3rd September 2014 1:12pm

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Boris Spasky says...
P. trifoliata can induce higher acid levels especially in cooler areas or clay.
I'd bud on both rootstocks, those grown commercially are on citrange.
Seems that curing is very much an important part of getting good tasting fruit.
Good luck!


Time: 3rd September 2014 9:51pm

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Brain says...
I got 2 kg, 8 of them in sat at carindale. Probably sold out or thrown out by now, as they are defn past their best. If i am honest, they tasted quite sour and just editable. So far i have had 2 and not a single seed. 6 more to go, wish me luck!


Time: 8th September 2014 12:50pm

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ivepeters says...
Got 4.25kg start of last week at woolies, only got two seeds.
Sure are seedless.

Time: 8th September 2014 2:33pm

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JohnMc1 says...
I thought I posted on here somewhere that they store the fruit for 20 to 40 days to decrease the acid levels and increase the brix before letting them out the door. With the company taking random samples, you are no doubt going to get some sour fruit.
I usually buy $20 worth at a time, the last three lots have produced zero seeds. I only have five seeds so far this year. I don't know why I'm still collecting seed, I have plenty of budwood and plant material for propagation. They have huge spikes, similar to Kei Apple.

Time: 8th September 2014 4:55pm

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Brain says...
I am not sure if my lot will last weeks, as the skin is starting to show signs of decay, though i like to entertain the thoughts of sweeter sumo.

I think the mandarins this year, incl all other vars, has been more misses than hits, with many of them have been particularly sour, even oranges are not faring better. Maybe its a seasons thing, as i recall a few years back, with a very hot spring/summer, the mandarins were sweet and the oranges were oversized.

Time: 9th September 2014 12:04am

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About the Author Brain
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JohnMc1 says...
A tad early but the Sumo buds on Tri are starting to grow nicely.
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Time: 19th January 2015 12:23pm

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About the Author JohnMc1
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sternus1 says...
Seedling you sent is vigorous and is growing well. Has the longest spines I've ever seen on a citrus and seems to grow in a strange clockwise circular pattern.

Time: 19th January 2015 1:43pm

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About the Author sternus1
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deano772263 says...
i love eating the sumo. i reckon if you keep them ripe on the tree it'll taste much better. i would to try and grow one at my place. do you sell 1 or 2 of the seed or budwood John?

Time: 16th January 2021 7:01pm

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