Jaboticaba (forum)

amanda starts with ...
Hi all... has anyone got these guys growing successfully? I don't know what to do with mine.. :( Happy Earth - what have you fed, watered and done with yours- it looks pretty good?

I have googled them but the info' is quite conflicting. Others forums say water and fertilise heaps to push them along - but the technical info' says water little and frequent and don't fertilise too much (as they are slow growing and thus sensitive)

Which is true!? I'm confused.

(mine nearly 3yrs and seedling small leaf type - from Daleys)

Time: 21st July 2009 10:28am

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About the Author amanda19
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HappyEarth says...
Hey Amanda,

Jaboticabas are naturally fairly slow growing. They seem to be always growing though - putting on a little flush of growth here there.

I just add compost and a bit of BD lifter around my jaboticabas (in fact just about all my fruit trees). Although fairly drought tolerant, they do LOVE WATER - as much as you can give them. They are on one of the few fruit trees that I grow, along with the black sapote and rollina, that thrive with lots of water. In fact in their native habitat they often get flooded with water.

Jaboticabas are well worth the effort and patience - One of my favorite trees aesthetically and the fruits and damn good too!

Hope this helps,

Rich
www.happyearth.com.au



Time: 21st July 2009 11:06am

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About the Author HappyEarth
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amanda says...
Thanks HappyEarth... what's BD lifter? Is that like "Seamungus"?
I am planting a Rollinia shortly - so it's helpful u mentioned that about the water too.

I have been really pleased to hear the feedback on the tastes of Jabo's and Grumichamma's - I can't wait!

Time: 21st July 2009 1:44pm

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About the Author amanda19
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HappyEarth says...
BD lifter is my acronymn for biodynamic lifter - otherwise known as chook pellets :)

Time: 21st July 2009 2:47pm

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amanda says...
hay Happy Earth - ha! and here I was imagining u guys filling up cow horns under the full moon and wondering if I should try it to get plants like yours!!! :)

Time: 21st July 2009 7:14pm

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About the Author amanda19
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Speedy says...
Jaboticabas in their natural habitat (the Cerrado region of Brazil) generally grow on sandy acidic soils around water courses and washes.
The climate in the Cerrado - semi-humid with distinct dry winter 800-1600mm rainfall.

My experience with growing them (Nthn. NSW)has been that they do best if you keep up fertility
and dont let the soil dry out too much
or for too long, otherwise they stop growing and take a bit to get them started again.
mulching every year with a feeding mulch is really beneficial.
Keep weed competition down, esp. grasses

Oh yeah, they hate being in the shade of other trees, at least around Nthn.NSW.
Though in Geraldton, with the intense sunlight and dry, they may well benefit from a bit of shade in the first few years.
Do what works in your climate and soils to modify microclimate in favour of your trees
A bit of background on the natural habitats of the trees you're growing is always a help in that regard.

Time: 22nd July 2009 11:16am

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About the Author Speedy
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Julie says...
HappyEarth, it's 'Dynamic Lifter' - nothing to do with biodynamics.

Were you making a joke?

Time: 22nd July 2009 4:01pm

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HappyEarth says...
Lol ... your right. I do use biodynamics and dynamic lifter here, hence the confusion :)

Is it too late to claim it as a joke?

Time: 22nd July 2009 4:26pm

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About the Author HappyEarth
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amanda says...
Buggar Happy Earth! does that mean u do do the cow horn thingo?! :))) I thought your plants looked too good 2 b true for chook pellets! Speedy - thanks again for the info.. i can't believe u can store so much in your brain - u r very lucky! :)

Time: 22nd July 2009 4:30pm

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amanda says...
PS Happy Earth..i wasn't taking the mickey! I see on your web site u use BD prep's - is Earth Magic home made or something u can buy?
My soil really needs help in this area...getting better all the time..but i have been looking at the Nutritech products..(can't afford them at present)..have u used any commercially available BD products?

Time: 23rd July 2009 9:40am

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About the Author amanda19
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HappyEarth says...
Hi Amanda,

lol ... no, someone else does the cow horn thing for us. 'Earth Magic' is our play on words for biodynamics. At our place we occassionally put out a biodynamics preparation called BD500. It cost almost nothing to buy and use - you can by it online if interested but you probably need to do a course first:

http://www.biodynamics.net.au/active_member_products.htm

Hope this helps,

Rich
www.happyearth.com.au

Time: 24th July 2009 8:31am

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About the Author HappyEarth
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amanda says...
Hay HappyEarth...I keep meaning to visit my local dog groomers (there's lots here) and start collecting the dog hair (lots of shearing done due to heat n grass seeds)...it's pure nitrogen..but would it b better to compost first?
I'm sure I could get hair from hairdresser too..but probly too many chemicals heh?
What do they put in the cow-horn? and what happens do u think?
I have always wondered about this?!

Time: 25th July 2009 8:55pm

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About the Author amanda19
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HappyEarth says...
They put horse manure (or is it compost) in a cows horn and bury it over winter. In spring its dugup and then small portions of this are mixed in water, stirred in a special way, and then scattered around.

The theory is esotecic and came from Rudolf steiner (have you heard of steiners schools?) who was a clairvoiyant. I guess it works in the same was as homeopathy. Its so cheap to apply I just do it anyway from time to time.

Rich
www.happyearth.com.au

Time: 26th July 2009 7:39am

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About the Author HappyEarth
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recher says...
jabots do love water

makes critical difference to fruit size

to induce early fruiting ringbark second half august any 3-4- year old limb provided tree is meter high

jabots do well in constantly moist soil provided it is not stagnant

rollinia in same position would rot
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1

Time: 26th July 2009 7:46am

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About the Author recher1
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recher says...
speedy replies
Oh yeah, they hate being in the shade of other trees, at least around Nthn.NSW.

I 100% disagree.

I am growing 78 jabots up to 30 years old

full sun in early years seems to bleach the leaves.

overall they look much nicer growing in shade

I also have many spontaneous seedlings that perform better than nursery grown stock. I have self sowners doing remarkably well germinating and keep on growing established in close proximity to much much bigger trees.

so far tho shade seems to be a limit on [production but too early to be deinitive

also chance sun yellowing nutrient defiency but condition obsrved all over town

Time: 26th July 2009 7:56am

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amanda says...
Hi recher..that's interesting thanks. It can b hard translating experience from one side of Aust to the other. The sunlight here in Geraldton is very intense.

I would never choose anything with big soft leaves for my garden as they just don't cope. Same with anything purple (eg:flax) they just burn up.

Yellowing on the sun-exposed side of citrus, in an intense sunlite situation, usually has some strange relationship with Zinc.. it would be interesting to experiment on a cupla your trees and see if Zinc spray helps?

Thanks for your comments - what do u feed yours? Where is dorroughby?

Time: 26th July 2009 10:16am

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About the Author amanda19
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Speedy says...
Hi Recher,
I agree, they do look much better in shade,both M.cauliflora and M.jaboticaba,
but what i said was really in regard to fruiting so was only part of the story and a bit of a misleading statement if not qualified.

There are a few trees I planted in Clunes ('93-'94?), some in full sun and , some in shade.
The ones in full sun fruited at younger age and yielded heavier crops than the ones in shade when they eventually did.
That's not to say that the ones in shade may not produce really well eventually.
The ones in sun are near the house and may get a bit more water than the others, I haven't seen them for a few years now.

Also I've had little experience with really mature trees.
Maybe I should reserve judgement for another 20-30yrs. :-)

I do remember you mentioning some years ago that cincturing large branches of Jaboticaba is a good way to induce fruiting.
It's also employed by some commercial Avocado growers in climatically marginal areas.

Three years ago I made 20 litres of Jaboticaba Wine...
Very nice. ;-P



Time: 27th July 2009 9:39pm

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About the Author Speedy
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amanda says...
Thanks Speedy..BTW: did u get my e-mail with the biolytix zone soil test results at all?

I think most of my sub-tropicals could do with some afternoon shade in the summer - while they are young. The combo of the wind, heat n sun is pretty full on?

I am looking forward to seeing how the microsprayers go and have recently got the wood-chip (+ other goodies) out around them - your advice in particular (and ohers) has been invaluable...the jabo's have recently put out a lovely flush of growth which I think is pretty positive as it's freezing at the moment! :((( (too many years north of 26th parallel has ruined me!!)

Time: 28th July 2009 9:25am

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amanda says...
Hi Recher - would u be able to tell me more about Rollinia please? I am going to plant one soon and it was the only one I could find in Perth (ex-Daleys plant) It sounds like a lovely fruit so I don't want to mess it up?

We recently had 2

Time: 30th July 2009 9:25am

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HappyEarth says...
Hi Amanda,

The Rollinia is quite tropical but it will survive 2 degrees but not much colder. They are deciduous during the winter here in Wollongong. At the Sydeny botanical gardens there is a really old rollinia that fruits every year - fruit are delicious! Like lemon custard :)

Rich
www.happpyearth.com.au

Time: 30th July 2009 3:09pm

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amanda says...
Thanks HappyEarth - that explains why my plant is so sad looking! Should I wait until spring to plant out?

The night/morning easterly is very cold here in winter - wind chill factor is brrrrr!!!
(But days are just lovely - about 20

Time: 31st July 2009 9:29am

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HappyEarth says...
Yeah ... i would wait until the cold winds have passed before planting out.

Good Luck!

Time: 31st July 2009 3:25pm

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About the Author HappyEarth
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recher says...
i'm not hygienic enuf for wine make but i turn out a five star jabot liqueur

shade does seem to influence fruiting downwards

Time: 1st August 2009 8:35am

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About the Author recher1
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recher says...
there are two rollinia species running around australia

they are generally mis-id'd

what is known as deliciosa is too tropical what is usually called mucosa is the hardier one.

i have them growing side by side and deliciosa struggles while mucosa fruits heavy and even self sows but dont tell the native plant Nazis bec they'll call it an invasive weed.

Time: 1st August 2009 8:39am

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About the Author recher1
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recher says...
dorroughby is east and north of lismore and west and north of byron

my main feeding program last few years centers on KN, meat bone meal, dolomite

Time: 1st August 2009 8:42am

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recher says...
hey happy earth

you want green sapote-grey

what's this grey thing?

Time: 1st August 2009 8:57am

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HappyEarth says...
Hey Paul,

'Grey' is a grafted variety that daleys sells. Im really just after a grafted green sapote. Do they fruit well for you at your place? How big do they get?

Interesting what you said about the rollinia being mid id'd ... sounds like the whole inga edulis confusion all over again.

Have a great day,

Rich
www.happyearth.com.au

Time: 1st August 2009 9:25am

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About the Author HappyEarth
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amanda says...
Hi Recher/Happy Earth...and it doesn't help that the plant is not ID'd either - mine a seedling but no marked as to mucosa/deliciosa.. :( Any way to tell difference?

Thanks for info Recher - is KN potassium nitrate? Is there any particular reason u use this (eg: cheaper, effective on your soil, etc?) Do u dissolve it in H2O or sprinkle?
How much do your subtropicals get?



Time: 1st August 2009 11:24am

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About the Author amanda19
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Speedy says...
I think the 'grey' is named after Don Grey (Gray?), a fruit grower in FNQ.

White sapote 'Chris' is also apparently names after his wife.
The story goes that she prevented him giving the original tree (seedling) the chop
for under performing (not fruiting) after many years, but when it eventually did fruit,
it was good enough to keep and distribute.

I seem to recall an Abiu cv.'Grey' also.


Time: 1st August 2009 11:47am

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recher says...
just a bearing seedling with no more or less superior characteristics than many other such performing seedlings.

for example i have a green sap that bears regularily up to a few hundred fruit* but i wouldn't give any name that didn't include the word seedling ('grey seedling')so people know it is not varietal status but a selected seedling.

* last crop was huge. bigger than any b4. (fertilizer) but had to coppice about 4m above ground where 4 major limbs stumped back to 800mm because the tree was so apical i couldn't harvest.

the coppicing has worked well and expect crop near future.

Time: 8th August 2009 4:16pm

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Justin says...
Recher, what's the flower in the photo you posted? It looks great, but doesn't look like a jaboticaba from the pictures I've seen on the net.
Thanks.

Time: 11th August 2009 11:19am

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culebra says...
a frangipani?

Time: 11th August 2009 6:09pm

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culebra says...
also which type of Jaboticaba is better to get?
i saw a both a small leaved and a large-leaved form at a nursery.

Time: 11th August 2009 6:31pm

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chia says...
Hey, I would love a recipe for jaboticaba wine or liqueur. I have grown jaboticaba's before up north and am in the process of growing some here in my backyard. I bought some wine years ago up in bundaberg and was great. Thanks. Chia
Pictures - Click to enlarge
View Image
Picture: 1

Time: 1st December 2009 8:13pm

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recher says...
you want both and more than one

they're distinct species

i know them as m. cauligflora now plinia edulis = small lf

m. jabotiacaba now plinia somethingornother = lrg lf

i have circa 78 m. cauli

and 8 m. jabot but wish i had 20-40



Time: 5th December 2009 12:48pm

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recher says...
it is a franjipani and i have no recollection of uploading it.

Time: 5th December 2009 12:53pm

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recher says...
if your rollnia is handling your winters okay its the more hardy species. the other you'd notice the suffering

kn...more for your money....less acidifying than other N sources?????....i've gotten god reslts with 25 kg kn, 40 kg blood bone 7-6-0, and 25 kg dolomite mixed

i use not enough. last couple years more than ever and itsabout 2 tons over 14 ha. with widevariability in who gets how much. i got 32 ha and dont fertilize the native forest, bit of paddock, or 7 bodies of water

i broadcast. i prefer the kn fines to granules bec. i get so much dew i believe it turns the kn component into a foliar feed on the udergrowth andoverallmore effective and less lossto air bbut this is contrary to recommendation and your climate might best be with granules.

i also put together the pto spray unit after buying it 20 years ago and have started foliar feed (motive fix boron defiency) with tractor and200 ltr drums


great fun not doing it nearly enuf

Time: 15th December 2009 12:22pm

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recher says...
yes they fruit very well tho there can be quality problems.

i grow both races

planting seed directly in ground is way to go

oldest tree always suffered cork bark rot...pretty much dead but several of itsself sown seedlings growing vigorously

superhealthy tree was 12 meters when i had it cut back to 6 bec it was so pyramidal i couldn't climb to get any of the circa 300 fruit

in two years it has coppiced and growing away very well with future fruits attainable

Time: 15th December 2009 12:28pm

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BJ says...
How long does it usually take for a Jabot to flower usually? Mine has a few cauliflowers afer only 6-8 months in the ground, and no larger, but a little sturdier, than those you usually find at bunnings etc. Is this normal?

My only real experience with them was my Grandfather's tree that took a full 7 years to flower, and from that point hasnt stopped fruiting profusely for about 8 years...

Time: 14th April 2010 9:40am

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JUJUBE FOR SALE IN MELBOURNE says...
Hi BJ,

It took my jaboticaba tree 8 years to flower. I only discovered last year that that the more you water you give to the tree, the more flowers you have, even in Melbourne climate this year I have had 160 fruits.

Time: 14th April 2010 10:32am

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BJ says...
I have an old, very large, plastic paint bucket that I have been using to catch rainwater from a broken down pipe. Every morning/afternoon before/after work I give the plant all 15+ litres. Maybe that is why its flowering already? And we've had alot of rain this season...

Time: 14th April 2010 11:56am

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amanda says...
oh BJ - I am envious! well done - I am going to hammer mine with water now!! thanks for the info so much! I have great drainage so wet feet no prob's here.

Tell us about the plant please!? where did u get it? is it grafted? what type - lge or small leaf? I don't know much but 6-8 months sounds great - how old do u think it was in the pot? What type of soil (+ it's pH) do u have? what do u feed it? (I can't look up your edibles as I am on dial up - too slow..)

Jujube - I am really inspired that u are getting fruit in Melb - I will take my 4 babies with me down south for sure!

Time: 14th April 2010 9:37pm

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BJ says...
I just went out and had a close check again with the torch. It has one large cauliflower, and a number (at least a dozen) protrusions from the trunk and lower branches which I am presuming will turn into flowers.

It is interesting as it has a sore at its base, presumably where a graft went a bit wrong. Could that also be stressing the plant into flowering?

The soil is an old quarry. I had a blueberry in the hole it is in. The Bluberry died, so I put the Jaboticaba in its spot, so it would be slightly acidic from the Blueberry soil. I just use Organic Xtra every few months. And I have been experimenting with 'man water' the last few weeks, as I couldn't be bothered to jump up the extra terrace to go on the citrus...

Time: 14th April 2010 10:06pm

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amanda says...
Hi BJ - for some reason I thought u were a female!? "boy/girl water" is great stuff! I have trained my family to bush wee...healthy urine is sterile (unlike poo) 1/10 dilution according to the texts...but u have rain.

So it's grafted, yes?

What kind of quarry? (eg: mineral sand, gravel etc..) Speedy mentions their natural environment above- sandy acidic soils around watercourses (which may indicate damp river sands...)

I have so many questions I'm afraid - it's really interesting to me!

Time: 15th April 2010 12:21am

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Steven says...
Thats funny. i was watching an article on TV where they are trying to develop a toilet where you do your business in two separate compartments of the bowl and your wee gets filtered to remove pharmaceuticals and bacteria so it can then be used on the garden.

Time: 15th April 2010 9:49am

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About the Author Steven
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BJ says...
Hi Amanda, this BJ is a boy, the other one is female.

It appears to be grafted. The sore I mentioned makes it a bit ambiguous, but the graft palnt seems to be growing a bit stronger than the seedling (above sore is slightly thicker than below)

The quarry is sandstone and bushrock. It takes hours to get a plant into the ground in the natural soil here.

We have a natural water course underground here. There is definately an almost permanent one 50m away, but I doubt the Jabot has tapped deep enough to find a source of its own. The house 2 doors down has an aquifer or spring explode under the house when it rains hard, and it seeps constantly. But I doubt that is close enough to help my trees out...

The plant is also shaded in the morning by a big mock orange until around 10.30.

At this stage they are still just flowers, so we'll see what happens...

Time: 15th April 2010 10:18am

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amanda says...
Good luck BJ! let us know how it goes. Hi Steven - wee will pick up some normal body flora as it passes the outer body skin ... if it's left to "ferment" in a holding tank then they will breed up and it gets quite smelly. If your urine was not sterile (in your bladder) - then u would have a urinary tract infection..fresh wee from a healthy person is very harmless and not germy at all - I think it's just the yukk factor for most folk.
Interesting about the toilet!

Time: 15th April 2010 12:03pm

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recher says...
Urine is a disease free great fertilizer that only burns plants if you repeetedly piss on them.

Save Time and Pee Direct.

Time: 25th April 2010 11:49am

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Jim says...
Unfortunately urine is not disease free from a human perspective since there are many viruses that can survive for long periods of time in people's urine. So while it may be a good idea to fertilize with urine in general, i would be cautious about urinating in areas where other people (especially children) would come into contact.

Time: 25th April 2010 12:36pm

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About the Author electra
Fremantle
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BJ says...
I thought I should post a few pictures quickly on here of the little Jaboticaba that has decided to fruit for me. It is about 60cm tall, has been in the ground less than a year, has at least a dozen flowers and one green fruit. I think I purchased it in a small grow bag from the nursery around the corner, which seems to get its stock from Forbidden Fruit, so it may have already been over 2yrs when purchased, but it still seems young/small to bear....
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Time: 2nd May 2010 11:00am

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PaulW says...
BJ, is this a grafted plant or a seedling? I have had mine in the ground for about 6 years or so and is not very big at all (maybe 5ft tall)and doesn't look like fruiting. Mine is a seedling unfortunately, so I was thinking of getting a grafted plant.

Time: 2nd May 2010 11:10am

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BJ says...
I mentioned earlier that I am sure it is grafted, but the graft is a bit strange.

Time: 2nd May 2010 11:17am

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amanda says...
Thanks for the pics BJ! Really interesting. My biggest and best Jab' got split right down the middle by a star picket - I taped it up but it was not fazed in the slightest - so it must be a fairly tough tree??

Anyway - I was wondering if u have something special there and should grow some of your seed and see if that is as precocious?
Recher would know - but he only pops in the forum very rarely.

Time: 2nd May 2010 11:47am

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amanda says...
An unfortunate accident saw the trunk of my jaboticaba cleaved almost in two last year. The wound was a couple days old when I discovered it. I bound it up as best I could - and today - a year later - removed the wraps etc.

It has healed and going well - tough tree - no fungal problems either. It may likely never be as strong at that point though - but it was worth a go? :)
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Time: 19th September 2010 8:16pm

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recher says...
never ever seen or heard of grafted jabot in this country.

jabots are great healers

i used to cincture branches in the early days to bring on fruit and they all healed rapidly

growing about 78 all over 22 years and a few 30 plus

biggest of the lollipops about 5 meters

this year i started to prune out the guts with a chain saw to access fruit easier and also maybe bigger fewer fruit???

i started doing this after viewing jaboticaba youtubes where the trees were obviously pruned this way

amanda...i couldnt be sure from the pic but r u sure you got the regular jabot as photo of tree looked like it could be large leafed species?

taxonomists now have jabots in genus Plinia but i'm still stuck on Myrciaria

using old nomenclature i got cauliflora, jaboticaba (lrg leaf), floribunda, vexator, glomerata, also marlieria edulis now plinia edulis, m. cauli. 'sabara', ....

what 'pisses' me off is there are sevral more specis and i dont have them

Biosecurity is a nightmare. Was a time you could bring in myrtacea no problem now they are rightfully paranoid about guava rust, and incorrectly scared of a humungous bunch of stuff

note a simple seed soak in 1% sodium hypochlorite eliminates guava rust fears.

Time: 29th September 2010 4:20am

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recher says...
jim wrote many viruses that can survive for long periods of time in people's urine. So while it may be a good idea to fertilize with urine in general, i would be cautious about urinating in areas where other people (especially children) would come into contact.

recher says if that were the case there'd be immense knowkledge and caution about proper disposal of urine.
1) my understanding is such viruses do not survive outside for a microsecond
2) viruses in urine do not compare to the bacterial load in poop. Yet everyone of us eats poop bacteria every day. Everyone of us harbours poop bacteria in our arm pits. You can not escape the little critters

Time: 29th September 2010 4:25am

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recher says...
just saw small leaf statement

Time: 29th September 2010 4:26am

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amanda says...
Thanks recher - I was surprised it healed so well - as the wood was sort of dry and "splintery" looking. I thought for sure it would get a fungus or such in the wound. But - there u go :)

Time: 29th September 2010 10:14am

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Michael says...
After hearing so many praises for this fruit that I finally got a tree and it's growing nicely in a pot . I didn't picture tasting the fruit until maybe 5 years later but came across it selling in a punnet for $3 at a fruit store in Westfield Liverpool NSW this morning . I got excited and bought two punnets . I was disppointed with the taste . The skin tasted bitter and there wasn't much flesh at all to it. It tasted almost like a purple grape with seeds . I'm putting this fruit on my tasted but dislike category . It's in there with the Pepino and Babaco. Now what do I do with the tree I'm growing ? Hopefully the Green Sapote doesn't fall into this category but where can I buy one to try ?

Time: 9th October 2010 9:02pm

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Michael says...
Pictures attached
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Time: 9th October 2010 9:08pm

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BJ says...
I dont eat the skins. The rest is fantastic.

Time: 9th October 2010 10:18pm

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amanda says...
Michael - I wouldn't give up yet :) Jab's are highly perishable and the one's u got may have been >2 days old and not a representative example!?

It's a bit like tasting a shop bought apricot - for your first ever apricot experience...??

Time: 9th October 2010 10:58pm

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Chia says...
Hi Folks, want to know who has cooked parsnip greens, i munch on them a little when working in the garden, sweet, and am tempted to add them to the juicer but have no info on them and this is only my 2nd year growing them and I have such a healthy crop, they look great. So, can I cook'em is the Q,
Cheers, Chia
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Time: 25th October 2010 4:58pm

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HappyEarth says...
I find they taste great - kind of like lychees, but definitely not with the skin. My main gripe with them is the flesh adheres to the seed strongly. Other than that, they are a superb backyard tree thats good to graze on when in fruit.

As for green sapote, that is very similar to mammey sapore if you have tried that. Its different and probably not to everyones taste at first. Imagine a sweet pumpkin and your getting close to how it tastes. You can buy them from tropical fruit world in summer.

Pepino and babaco rate well down the list of edible fruits for me too.

Easting my first crop of cherimoyas at the moment - WOW! I hope you have one of those planted Michael?

Rich
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Time: 25th October 2010 5:08pm

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Phil@Tyalgum says...
I had my first taste of Jaboticaba this week - the family dog was helping itself to fruit which had fallen from the tree, otherwise we wouldn't have even known they were there amongst the foliage. Would highly recommend growing them, pity they are so slow to crop. A nightmare to clean the seeds if you wish to post them, the pulp clings to the seed and is very difficult to clean off.
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Time: 25th October 2010 5:21pm

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HappyEarth says...
OMG ... look at all the fruit on that jaboticaba!

Time: 25th October 2010 5:29pm

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j says...
That's amazing, phil. How old is that tree btw? It looks massive!!

Time: 25th October 2010 8:44pm

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John Mc says...
Pepino and Babaco down the list of favourites? I don t know about that.
I had a beautiful very sweet, very juicy excellent tasting Babaco on the WE, sweet as, skin and all.
Today, I picked a beatiful very sweet very juicy rockmelon tasting Pepino, yummo.
You might have to try some of mine sometime.

Time: 25th October 2010 9:41pm

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Michael says...
Hi Rich ,

It's almost been a year since I've been to your garden . I can still recall those big delicious paw paw you have growing. I really want to grow a Cherimoya but I don't think I have the space. They are actually hard to find at my local nurseries. Even though I don't like the Babaco but it does look very impressive hanging from the tree. I have three plants in pots full of fruits. I gave a pot each to my sister and mother and they seemed to like the fruit. The one I have left is starting to branch out as well.

Time: 25th October 2010 11:02pm

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J says...
Jaboticaba cross pollination question:

I have 1 jab from perrys. Would buying another Jab help with future pollination and better fruit set?



Time: 27th October 2010 9:21am

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HappyEarth says...
One tree should be enough

Rich
www.happyearth.com.au

Time: 27th October 2010 12:16pm

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recher says...
no

Time: 6th November 2010 6:52am

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j says...
I've got one Jab from perrys and another from Daleys. Perry's tree has smaller leaves and Daleys has the bigger ones. They are within 20 feet from each other, so I'm assuming they are different varieties should cross pollinate each other. I've included pics.

The perrys jaboticaba has leaves that seem to a little yellow on the edges. When it dropped it leaves earlier this month and popped out a new flush, the new leaves where almost lime yellow. They have since started to get greener in colour. Is this normal? Or do the yellow edges signify lack of something?

I've kept the soil moist & mulched and the mix I have used is acidic.


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Time: 14th November 2010 1:37pm

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Violet_Cactus says...
Wow Phil, that is a very cool jaboticaba photo!

Time: 15th November 2010 9:34pm

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Mario says...
Hi Michael,
What shop in Westfield Liverpool did you find the Jaboticabas? Any idea where it comes from?
Thanks

Time: 18th November 2010 3:14pm

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Michael says...
Hi Mario,

It's the fruit store on the lowest level next to the carpark. I think there is only one fruit store . It's in the section called the market.

Time: 21st November 2010 8:17pm

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amanda says...
I am wondering if Jaboticabas are 'extremely' salt sensitive? I have noticed that since mine have been watered with only rain water- they are looking so much better.

They are in tree sacks in the shade house now - but we have had good consistent rain this winter - plus I am using it from the tanks - and they are going mad this winter!?

I wasn't expecting much growth over the cold winter - but they have put out the most they ever have? (and no burnt margins or yellowing either...)

They also seem to love Seasol/Seaweed?

Time: 1st August 2011 9:24am

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BJ says...
They hate salt. I started emptying the baby's bath water on the plants and noticed a few (jaboticaba, bananas and carmbola esp.) didn't seem to like it. I assumed the baby products wouldnt be too bad for the garden, but when I read the label there were about 50 different forms of sodium in there. So now it just goes on the tolerant plants - kwai muk, a few eugenias, sapodilla and wongai.

Time: 1st August 2011 9:37am

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amanda says...
Thanks BJ - I just found an interesting site that discusses salinity issues with a variety of plants - seems that chemical fert's are not the way to go for these guys also (increases salinity)

They recommend weak fish emulsion and NO chemical nitrogen sources...(only organic) I am guessing it is finding the regular rainfall more reliable than my forgetfulness too! :-O

I have been really surprised at how hardy and satisfying the kwai muk is to grow..? So far mine has not been bothered by anything in Gero - not even the scale or aphids that were invading the plants right next to it.

It's a plant I would be prepared to try in many locations...what do u think?

Time: 1st August 2011 10:06am

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Mike says...
My jaboticabas get burnt leaf edges very easily when I fertlise with strong NPK chemical fertlisers and they hate chlorides in the fertliser.They have fruit now and usually have 2 to 5 fruitings a year.My large leaf type is yet to fruit and yellow jabs will never fruit.I saw a tree that has huge furry fruit and bares just once or twice a year.

Time: 5th August 2011 7:21pm

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amanda says...
Thanks Mike. What do u feed yours?

Time: 5th August 2011 9:26pm

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Mike says...
Amanda blood and bone,micronutrients, dolomite and basalt rockflour mix and for NPK 10;10;10 mix of sulphates of N and K as well as good P.The 3 types are not applied at the same time with B&B used most.

Time: 5th August 2011 11:07pm

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amanda says...
Ok Mike - thanks again...I will give the B&B with 10% potash a try :) Anyone know how to get basalt rockflour in WA? Does it have a brand name?

I have a top quality liquid trace element product that I like using - maybe this will be ok.

They greened up beautifully one year (in the ground) but I didn't write it in my black book - I can't quite remember what it was - maybe the liquid Powerfeed, followed by seasol I put thru the fertigation system...

They suffered badly from the 'yellows' in my orchard... :-( (which has the secondary-recycled water sub reticulated in the soil...) They were totally plethoric in there.

Time: 6th August 2011 11:43am

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Mike says...
Amanda the rockflour is called min+ and because my natural ph is a feather below 6 dolomite is helpful.With the micronutrients I start with the basice yates or searles shaker and add extra boron,chelated fe and zn/mn.I don't need mn really as I sometimes use mancozeb.They fruit mostly in response to sudden water after a few weeks of dryness.Summer crops are bigger and tastier.

Time: 6th August 2011 3:43pm

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amanda says...
Lucky U Mike. I am really looking forward to the day I get to try this fruit :) I am using liquid HiTrace (from a rural supplier) it's great value - 60ml thru my fertigation system does around 70 trees!

It has everything except Mg (magnesium - which I don't need much of anyway) - I don't know why it doesn't have Mg - it would be interesting to ask the Aust manufacturer.

My natural soil pH is a 'feather', or two, over neutral. But the subsoil horizon is that bright yellow coarse brickies sand....it's actually lovely stuff. But under that is limestone :-(

Here is a pic of what mine used to look like, in the ground. Very unhappy guys...
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Time: 6th August 2011 10:14pm

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Mike says...
Amanda frustratingly they drag their 'backsides' for the first 3 years or so then speed up and fruit at about 5 years old and 2.5m.They are very heavy cropping and rather sweet and grape like.You bite or gum a split in the skin and suck out the middle swallowing seeds like passionfruit and spit out the skin.

Time: 7th August 2011 7:55pm

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amanda says...
Do you prune yours Mike? (do they ever need it?)

Time: 8th August 2011 2:19pm

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Recher says...
YES- I prune for two reasons

1) Too often they get an unthrifty, see thru look, esp. after heavy fruitings. I cut back by 1/3 to 1/2

2) LAst year after looking at some jaboticaba youtubes, I thinned out by removing a lot of branches. I'm talking jabots that are 4 to 5.5m high with mulitple vertical crisscrossing branches. remove up to 2/3. Will certainly make accesssing fruit easier. Results not in.

Time: 13th August 2011 6:32pm

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Mike says...
I enjoyed some today and noticed both rambutam and mangosteen flowering out of season.Yes Amanda I prune the living daylights out of them.I keep them at 4m and 4m diameter with a window slice to the centre for plucking.They get well over 10m tall and are very densely foliaged.One at Kamerunga must have been 15m tall and a 6m wide cylinder that was almost impenetrable.I remove about 40% of the foliage once a year and contain height and width.

Time: 13th August 2011 6:47pm

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amanda says...
Great info Recher and Mike - thanks. I have been a bit nervous to touch mine as they are so slow growing.

Mine are still very small after 4yrs - I don't think I have the 'hang' of growing them yet. Our summer seems to knock them back a fair bit - but they are going well in this, their wettest winter so far (lol - mine still less tham 1m tall after 4yrs - can't imagine a 15m tall tree!)

So if you remove branches are u not removing fruting wood though? Doesn't it fruit on the same wood year after year? Or do you need some new wood?

Time: 14th August 2011 10:44am

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Mike says...
Amanda they fruit so prolifically with branches tightly packed it is a small sacrifice.There are many kg of fruit at each fruiting event.I have two smaller (1.5m) trees at about 3 years old and I expect them to soon stop dragging their backsides and reach the boom threshold.

Time: 14th August 2011 8:24pm

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amanda says...
Damn Mike - I'll have to get my guys up running then! :) kg's of fruit sounds right up my alley. Maybe this winter is them finally doing their thing...fingers crossed! :D

I've never seen such a sluggish plant before...if it were anything else I would have given up by now.
I get the feeling it's one of "those one's" and that once you nail it's requirements then u see some action..
The only other plant I have this much trouble with is my african pride..

Time: 15th August 2011 9:34am

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gus says...
I am hearing mixed things about whether Jaboticaba requires a mate or not. Has anyone had good success with a single Jaboticaba tree?

Time: 15th August 2011 2:16pm

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JUJUBE FOR SALE IN MELBOURNE says...
I have a 16 year old jaboticaba trees. the biggest crop was 50 fruits the year before last, some of those as big as a 50 cent coin.
http://www.daleysfruit.com.au/my/l/2369/jaboticaba-grafted.jpg

Time: 15th August 2011 2:34pm

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gus says...
was this a single tree or does it have a neighbour jujube?
How many years did it take to get your first fruit?

Time: 15th August 2011 3:28pm

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JUJUBE FOR SALE IN MELBOURNE says...
Hi Gus,

Yes, it was a single tree and no one in my area has this tree. It started to flower in the 7th year but set fruits 3 years later when I gave it lots of rain water.

Time: 15th August 2011 6:42pm

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gus says...
Sure a lot of people will be glad to hear that. Does it fruit every year?
I can hardly picture what 50 fruit would look like. I guess that would be a fair few punnets.
I can't wait to get just one fruit off this tree.

Time: 15th August 2011 7:38pm

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JUJUBE FOR SALE IN MELBOURNE says...
Hi Gus,
It does have flowers twice a year around October and April depending on the weather, some fruit set occurs but not last year due to unseasonal weather (too cold). 50 fruits may be 4 or 5 putnets.
This fruit tree is highly recommended if you can wait.

Time: 15th August 2011 7:56pm

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allybanana says...
Good to hear, hopefully I also get two crops a year in Eden, I had two flower flushes on my large leaf form, last season and got one fruit on the second flush. I didn't get much, as i invited around my fruit geek mates for the tasting and we divided it up. But all were impressed with the flavor and consequently bought trees.

Time: 15th August 2011 9:44pm

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Eden
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gus says...
I think it is a really nice looking tree anyway and like having it in my garden. I have considered getting another to help with pollination, but 2 non producing trees on a small block might test my patience!
Very generous of you allybanana to share your only fruit. How many years did you wait for one fruit?

Time: 15th August 2011 10:58pm

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amanda says...
Jujube - intersting comment about the rain water..thanks - I have a feeling this may be quite important for these guys...

Time: 15th August 2011 11:42pm

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gus says...
sure your tapwater isn't too alkaline for them Amanda? Maybe they need a little squeeze of lemon? I think they like acidic conditions. I have only had mine for a couple of months but I have put it in azalea potting mix and it appears to have grown a little already. I thought I was imagining it, but my wife noticed it too.

Time: 16th August 2011 12:18am

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gus says...
sure your tapwater isn't too alkaline for them Amanda? Maybe they need a little squeeze of lemon? I think they like acidic conditions. I have only had mine for a couple of months but I have put it in azalea potting mix and it appears to have grown a little already. I thought I was imagining it, but my wife noticed it too.

Time: 16th August 2011 12:18am

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amanda says...
My tap water is crap gus (had it analysed) It's an interesting problem as fruit trees cannot handle as much salinity as even humans (in the water) Like I always say - if only plants had kidneys then all would be sweet! ;)

Time: 16th August 2011 12:41am

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JUJUBE FOR SALE IN MELBOURNE says...
Mine started to grow and flowering when I gave it lots of falling leaves as mulch and lots of water and azalea fertilizer.

Time: 16th August 2011 7:55am

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amanda says...
Might get my pH test kit out and check the potting mix today - thanks guys! :)

(ps - yes gus - the tap water is on the alkaline side - and very hard also...) Speedy mentioned the acidity thing above too...

Time: 16th August 2011 9:08am

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gus says...
I think that could be a good idea Amanda. Is your Jab a large leaf or a small leaf? Seems people are having more success and bigger fruit from the large leaf?

Time: 17th August 2011 3:03pm

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Mike says...
Amanda,your tree still looks alright and as I said before they are sooks about chlorides and strong fertlisers when young.The ph should be around 6.5 and I never water my ones.Just keep mulching and fertilising and it will take off eventually.I prefer the small leaf jaboticaba as they have larger and more frequent crops and taste a bit better I reckon.There are a few other types in Aust. and heaps in sth america and some have larger rougher fruit that are not as smooth.

Time: 17th August 2011 8:08pm

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gus says...
That is interesting to hear mike. How big are the fruit? I assumed grape size but have read they are much smaller than that.

Time: 17th August 2011 9:08pm

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amanda says...
I have no idea if they are large or small leaf types? I had them sent over from Daleys a few years back - but the label didn't say which one.

What's the size difference between the two leaves?

Mike - the trees got worse than that than that pic, eek! ....(just couldn't find the photo) I thought I was going to lose them.

They look good now - in tree sacks in the shade house. It's far too hot and dry for them in summer, here.


(pH is around 5.5 - so maybe too acid?)

Time: 17th August 2011 9:44pm

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Mike says...
Amanda the small leaf type like yours has leaves about 30 to 35mm long is densely foliaged and has fruit 22mm to 27mm in diameter,rarely to 35mm and some are smaller.The larger leaf type has sparser foliage and leaves around 55 to 60mm long with fruit browner and less shiney.pH of 5.5 is ok, and they are heat tolerant so long as humidity is not too low.If UV gets above 16 for prolonged periods the leaves of most trees burn.

Time: 18th August 2011 9:33pm

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amanda says...
Wow - that's really interesting Mike! thanks heaps. Mine def' small leaf then. Now I know :) Yea - summer sees very low humudity and high UV here. No wonder they were struggling in the orchard...poor things.

They should be happier when we move south...thanks again - you have explained a lot that I was missing.

Time: 18th August 2011 9:39pm

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Mike says...
They are supposed to be very tolerant and should be alright if they have enough water when it is dry,even when well over 40 celcius.

Time: 18th August 2011 9:47pm

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amanda says...
Maybe Mike - but it's very harsh here. I noticed when I dug them up that they didn't have much of a root system - certainly not a deep one. Maybe the sand drains far too fast.
The Wampi's (right next to them) couldn't have been more different - with a large matted fibrous root system - no wonder they love their food n water...!?
Some sub tropical plants don't handle the summer here (except the kwai muk) The atemoyas, longons, wampi's and rollinia all suffered. Mangoes and loquats hate it here too (too saline) but other things adore it - passionfruit, citrus, acerola, guava, peach n nectarine, fig, grape, mulberry, white sapote, grumichama, kei apple, pitanga, beach cherry, capulin.

I think it has a lot to do with the salinity, strong winds and lack of humudity. It's not a place for the more tricky species I guess, yet. Maybe they needed a more shady spot rather than full sun. That was my 'feeling' anyway.

I am determined to keep them going now that they can't be imported from over east....so that they can be shared with my fellow species-starved west aussies! :)


Time: 18th August 2011 11:26pm

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gus says...
Great info Mike, thanks. I was getting cold feet with my small leaf Jab but sounds like they are just as good as the big leaf.

That is very acidic water amanda. I am surprised by that. The blueberries will love you

Time: 18th August 2011 11:34pm

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amanda says...
(ps Mike - here they are now...much happier :)
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1

Time: 18th August 2011 11:46pm

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amanda says...
(also - that's the pH of the soil gus - the pH of our tap water is 8)

Time: 19th August 2011 12:02am

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gus says...
That sounds more like it. Have you added sulfur to the soil to get it so acidic or is that just its natural composition? I didn't think there would be many places in Oz to have acidic soil.

Time: 20th August 2011 12:23am

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amanda says...
They are in big tree sacks gus (ready for when we get to move...sometime this century) Haven't done anything to the mix (premium potting mix plus some pig poo)
I am curious/surprised as to how it can be that way though...maybe it's the decomposing leaf litter..? I was using an Osmocote slow release fert also. I will keep an eye on it from now on.

Will stick to the rainwater, blood n bone and seasol I think...
I really don't like managing fruit trees in pots, myself, it can be hard to to keep everything just right.

Time: 20th August 2011 11:25am

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Raz says...
Hi Amanda,

Where did you get the Jaboticaba tree from? I could not find any in Perth and I would love to grow some.

Raz

Time: 27th October 2011 6:11pm

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Gus says...
Tas1trees has them:

http://www.tass1trees.com.au/

They are in Baskerville. I have recently got two from there.

Time: 27th October 2011 8:46pm

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amanda says...
yup - that's where I got mine Raz...

Time: 28th October 2011 11:50am

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Richo says...
Hi, Everyone I have read this forum a few times in the past couple of years.
I am in Brisbane planted a Jab 10 years ago my dog split it first year but it survived and this year I had fruit for the first time, about 60 fruit do they fruit more as they mature?

Time: 30th October 2011 8:22pm

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Ellen says...
yes definitely, the bigger the trunk get the more fruits you'll get.

Time: 30th October 2011 8:59pm

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Mike says...
The bigger they get the more fruit that have alright.My two largest are around 8 years old and have been fruiting several times a year for around 4 years and are currently smothered in flowers.I get at least a bucket of fruit when their cropping peaks.

Time: 30th October 2011 9:14pm

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David says...
My tree has been in 20 yrs+. Its just finished fruiting ,this first one this spring was a doosey, ive never seen so many flowers,and covered in bees.Your right Mike the older they get the more fruit you get,this time we could only eat about 10% i reckon.

Time: 31st October 2011 6:33pm

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amanda says...
20yrs David! Nice one! Do they fruit on the minor branches too - or just the main trunk?

Time: 31st October 2011 10:40pm

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David says...
Hi Amanda, no right out to the tips of the smallest branches

Time: 1st November 2011 7:36am

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Gus says...
A Jaboticaba tree 20 years ago must have been really exotic.

Time: 1st November 2011 12:35pm

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David says...
Hi gus ,yes i guess it was,still is to some degree.Its only people like you and me and all of us here on this forum that make the difference,to make the exotic,as common as eating an apple,or mango ,or whatever.

Time: 1st November 2011 11:06pm

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Gus says...
don't get me wrong, they are still very much an exotic. I have never eaten one, or even seen a Jabot tree.
I have met very few people that have tried them, but most that do seem to highly recommend them.
I just can't imagine something so popular to those that have experienced them, being almost unheard of outside these forums.
I would imagine that 20 years ago without such forums, the jab would be even more rare?
Has anyone seen a fruiting Jaboticaba in Western Aus?

Time: 3rd November 2011 12:02am

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lang says...
Hi Gus, mine has a few fruit on it at the moment, first time fruiting. It has been growing in a pot for about 3 or maybe 4 years now.

Time: 3rd November 2011 1:50am

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Gus says...
Hi Lang
That is a quick fruiting jabot.
You will have to tell us how it tastes.
I am very jealous! (although glad to know they grow in Perth)

Time: 3rd November 2011 11:54pm

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amanda says...
Nice one lang! Hope for us yet :) Gus - it might be because they don't store well (about 3 days some say..?)
It's one of the major reasons we don't see a lot of fruit in the shops, sadly (like loquats too...) :-(

Time: 4th November 2011 10:01am

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KjW says...
Hi All, This is my Jaboticaba in Rockhampton
I planted the tree in 2000 approx 600mm high, not sure which month and it first fruited in 2009.
It's now about 3.5/4m high, I had 1.2m of water in the yard during the floods and thank goodness it survived, I lost a few trees that were just as tall and lost everything that went under water.
The fruit vary in size as can be seen in the pics. They have a tougher skin than grapes with one pea sized seed.
It's hard to discribe the taste, I wouldn't say they were anything exciting(not like a Mango) but they are quite morish grabbing handfulls off the tree while your getting around the garden.
I had some in a container just covered with water and they were still quite edible after about a week.
Cheers Ken

It's a bit hard to distinguish the tree with the others in the background, so I've added an extra pics with it outlined.
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1
Picture: 2
Picture: 3
Picture: 4
Picture: 5

Time: 4th November 2011 11:35am

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Gus says...
They are great pics kjw.
I can't beleive how big your tree is.
Interesting to hear the different opinions on how the fruit tastes. I guess it is a personal preference, but it is still really cool growing a fruit that you never see for sale.
Interestingly the leaves on your tree look like a big leaf variety? Is a little hard to tell, but
i think the leaves on mine look smaller.


Time: 4th November 2011 9:09pm

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KjW says...
G/Day Gus, I just checked the leaves, the biggest is roughly 40mmx15mm, so I'd assume that would be classed as small leaf.
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1

Time: 5th November 2011 12:17pm

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amanda says...
Thanks for the pics KjW - what a gorgeous tree!! They must really like the climate over that way - mine are not even up to my hip yet and they are roughly 5 yrs (maybe 6)

Time: 5th November 2011 12:21pm

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KjW says...
Hi Amanda, WOW! I know their slow growing, but yours are exceptionally slow.
Must be the relaxed life style over there or something so their in no hurry to grow.
I'd say I might have better soil here (brown river flat soil)only being about 200m from the Fitzroy River.
I've never fed the tree other than mulch & plenty of water, the worms might have helped a bit to...
I'm just glad it survived the flood and I'm now able to enjoy the fruit from it.

Time: 5th November 2011 12:48pm

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dawes says...
Any ideas why a healthy ,happy 10 y.o. Jab. would drop all its fruit at pea size? Has been a consistent performer til now. PS The temp gets down to 9deg C .occasionally.

Time: 5th November 2011 1:46pm

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KjW says...
Not real sure, But I think I'd try a dose of either Dolimite or Epsom Salts and some Potash
Someone else might have a better solution
Good luck

Ken

Time: 5th November 2011 2:35pm

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M Nash says...
I just bought a small tree from Tropical fuit world (Twelve inch high) It is a Daleys product and after the name "Jaboticaba" It has (MT) in brakets. Does this mean its murcoted? And will I be expecting many years before fruit?

Time: 13th November 2011 3:36pm

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Nick says...
Hey M Nash MT refers to the pot type, in this case it means Mega Tube http://www.daleysfruit.com.au/Plant-Pot-Size.html#Adv) :)

Time: 13th November 2011 3:53pm

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M Nash says...
Ahh , Thanks,, So I have a long wait :)


Time: 13th November 2011 7:32pm

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denise says...
In the far north of New Zealand, the jaboticaba has up to 6 crops per year. A single cut around the branches with secateurs-without removing any bark- brings on flowering above the cut.Seeds of fast bearing hybrids can be bought from Fruitlovers in Hawaii. They can bear at 3 years old.

Time: 13th November 2011 8:51pm

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David says...
There used to be a rather large jaboticaba, on Dick Endt's property back in the 80"s,for all of you out there dick endt used to live in Auckland NZ.Iseem to recall it was at least 2 to 2half m tall. Nice guy Dick and his wife

Time: 14th November 2011 6:21pm

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amanda says...
Thanks for the info denise & David - that's interesting about them growing in Auckland. We can google the max and min temps for Auckland and see how they compare to some Aust climates.
Does Auckland get frost?

Time: 14th November 2011 9:15pm

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Doug says...
I have a m.cauliflora that I think I bought from PR some years ago. It is in a tub and I have tip pruned it so it is now one and a half metres high and wide. First flowering this year has given me 6 fruit that are nearly ripe, but the second flowering just finished looks like a much bigger fruit set. However, all the flowering and fruiting is on the tip growth - I have never seen flowers on the old wood. Perhaps they behave differently in Melbourne?

Time: 20th November 2011 3:35pm

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Mike says...
My 2 biggest trees are currently festooned from the ground to the tips with dozens of kg's of whoppers.There is only so many you and everyone you know can eat.My large leafed one had its first fruit also and they were huge and a bit furry on the skin.Once they reach 2m or so they seem to fruit madly.

Time: 21st November 2011 10:20pm

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amanda says...
Show off ;-) I am just envious Mike.


Time: 22nd November 2011 12:41am

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Gus says...
Very jealous Mike.

How do they taste?

Time: 23rd November 2011 12:28am

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Mike says...
Gus they have been exquisite,extra sweet and very large, with fruit from one tree being almost seedless.The taste this time around (as I am eating them now) is somewhere between grape and starapple.My mangosteen has also put in an excellent performance in the last week with lots of very large sweet fruit

Time: 24th November 2011 8:49pm

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amanda says...
Nice work Mike. My Jab's are much happier with the blood and bone now, thanks :) (so is the lychee et al)

I find it nerve wracking keeping all my special stuff in tree sacks...eg: the Kwai Muk has filled the big sack with roots already...I don't know what I am going to do with it, if we don't move in the near future...if I keep 'sacking' it up I am going to need a forklift to move it!? :D

Time: 25th November 2011 6:38pm

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Raz says...
Hi Lang,

Where did you get your Jaboticaba from? I have been trying to get a tree for a few months now, but the only ones available are in QLD and won't ship to Perth.

Regards,

Raz

Time: 9th December 2011 6:18pm

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Perth
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brad says...
tassone should have them. call Joe to check on 0419 988 344
http://www.tass1trees.com.au/fruittrees.php

Time: 12th December 2011 12:25pm

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brad says...
a bit of hessian wet in the morning to give some humidity and buffer the dry wind might help you amanda???

Time: 12th December 2011 12:25pm

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lang says...
Hi Raz
Picked up Jaboticaba from Joe at Tass1 about 4 years ago together with a Grumichama.
Hi Gus
They taste somewhat like a aromatic grape, a little of white necterine and hints of mangosteen. One or 2 small seeds in each, none in the smaller fruits. Nice, definitely worth waiting for. Unlike my grunichama, large bunch of seeds, hardly any flesh although taste nice otherwise. Is it just my plant?

Time: 13th December 2011 12:03am

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Mike says...
I have a very sweet large fruiting yellow gramichama with thick flesh.It is much better than some yellow lines and way better than the purples, like the one I chopped out.The fruit is not as sweet or desirable as jaboticaba which I have right next to it.What they have in common is a big response to fertiliser with larger sweeter and more fruit and much variation in fruit taste between trees and even seasons.

Time: 13th December 2011 9:07pm

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Gus says...
Hi Lang

I am surprised to hear that they are fruiting after only 4 years. Also very encouraging to hear you are in Perth and got your tree from Tass1 like me.
Does it have a very thick trunk?
I kind of assume that i will be driving a hover car and wearing a silver space suit before I see a Jab groing on my tree.


Time: 15th December 2011 12:27am

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Mike says...
They are way slower in a cooler place and even in Cairns it csn take 8 ot 9 years for unwatered,unfertilised plants in less than ideal spots to fruit.Gus unless you mollycoddle it there could be a civil on the martian colonies before you are enjoying thr fruit.

Time: 17th December 2011 8:39am

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nick giancola says...

Hi Gus. Its nice to see a post from a neighbour [ i live in gwelup] can you tell me are they reasonably easy to grow in our sandy soil?

Time: 26th December 2011 3:31pm

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amanda says...
Could kiss u Mike! :D My Jab's are powering along with the B&Bone now! No burnt leaf margins, with rainwater also...lovely good fungi in the pot with the sphagnum moss...no dramas!

I just give them a tablespoon or so every month (cos they are in sacks) Putting out new growth constantly - no paleness in the leaves at all now, no aphid problems either.

Happy Amanda!

Time: 3rd January 2012 11:59pm

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Gus says...
Hi guys,
Just back from holiday.
Hi Nick Giancola, I have had one of mine growing for only aboout a year now and the other for 6 months. they seem pretty healthy. I added a bit of acidic soil and a couple of other things to keep the acidity up, which they seem to like. They seem a pretty hardy tree and i think they are really nice looking.

Time: 4th January 2012 8:43pm

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kim says...
Hi all,
i have been reading reading and re-reading this thread for a while and have finally made a purchase of 4 jaboticabas from Blooming Nursery (in Jandabup). They stand at around 6 feet tall and quite slender looking. So excited! apparently they're 6-7 yrs old, so hopefully i'll get fruit sooner rather than later?

:)

Time: 23rd January 2012 3:43am

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Rev says...
I'm told the trick to making good wine and germinating them is the same
Let's the skin and pulp ferment few days then strain.
The colour comes from the skin
The seeds enjoy the ferment and my friend who sells trees swears they all come up like crazy soon after being planted

Time: 23rd January 2012 4:04am

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Jan says...
Hi, I have been following this jaboticabas thread. I have planted one (northern NSW)on a southern facing slope, where it will not get a lot of water. I guess that I shall treat it as an experiment now...

My question. I would like to plant more in an area that drains into a sizeable soak (small dam when really wet) - and in a lot of clay. Soooo....it gets wet, then wetter, and often squelchy sodden. But when it dries out, the clay cracks up. Do I hear happy jaboticabas? Any advice/optinion appreciated.


Time: 28th January 2012 6:36pm

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amanda says...
Hi Jan - of u go right to the top of this thread the first few posts that help? Not sure how they would go in soggy clay though...

Time: 29th January 2012 11:41am

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Gus says...
Hi Kim

I think the thicker the trunk and branches the closer they are to fruiting.
Blood and bone has also done wonders with my Jab and they have never looked healthier.
Were your Jabs very pricey? I was thinking about getting one for my parents, but I think for a six footer they are around the $100 mark?


Time: 29th January 2012 5:55pm

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amanda says...
Good score kim - I'd grab one in a flash if I was there :) Did they have many? They may be harder to get now that they can't be imported..?

I agree with Gus too - B&Bone has been the best thing for mine too...they have never looked back since...Stay away from synthetic ferts... :(

Time: 29th January 2012 7:12pm

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kim says...
Thanks Gus and Amanda for your tips - is it safe to give them blood & bone straight away? i'm too scared to give them anything more than a tiny bit of slow release fertilizer when we put them in the ground.

The trees we picked up were retailing at a bargain of $68!! but we did hear that they were being re-potted soon as they appear to be outgrowing their pots - no doubt they will increase in price to match.

Amanda - they had quite a fair number when we were down there last weekend. I didn't know that they can't be imported any longer? Wow - I might have to go grab some more, they're such beautiful trees... I can't stop admiring mine. :)

Time: 30th January 2012 12:34am

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amanda says...
That's damn good value (for WA) Kim! Well done :) What's your soil like? what suburb are u in? Are u in an established/shady suburb? New suburb? Sandy? Beachy? Loamy/clay?

There is loads of help for your precious purchase here :)

I am not sure I would plant them in this WA heat right now...? U can always re-pot into tree sacks until winter..a little bit more expense but perhaps worth it. Depends on your 'patch'?

They are lovely kim - and from all accounts the fruit is worth waiting for and/or useful. I would hazard a guess that WA might not be an ideal climate perhaps...but some plants are actually worth a bit of extra work...? :)

There are issues with salinity and chem fert's and also our dry/intense heat/sun.
I would not plant them until this autumn at least - and then get back to this forum for advice? Maybe a level teaspoon of B&bone every 2-3 weeks and some dilute seasol every 1-2 weeks...just to keep them going for now (if u don't re-pot?)
What kind of potting mix are they in? Is it cheap rubbish? Are their roots poking out of the bottom of the pot?

Time: 30th January 2012 1:10am

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kim says...
my soil is the predictable sand and builders waste - so nothing to boast about. I'm in Dianella, the older part.

The four jaboticabas i mentioned are already in the ground (hedging our driveway) - hopefully they'll be ok? do you think i should get them out and into tree bags and replant in autumn? we gave them some seasol and coffee grounds and it may just be my imagination, but they seem to look a lot healthier already.

We are so happy with how they look that we went and got two more! I love these trees - can't wait for the fruits, but they are absolutely stunning specimen. We also got a bit carried away and purchased a miracle fruit plant as well as a tiny hog plum tree. So excited - just have to figure out where to put the new purchases now. :) Hopefully we'll get to taste all these wonderful fruits soon.



Time: 31st January 2012 6:00pm

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amanda says...
Lol...Kim - it sounds like u have caught the bug - welcome to the fruit tree addicts Forum! :D
Well - they are in the ground and seem ok - so may as well leave them?
Have a good read of this thread - Speedy and Happy Earth's at the beginning? There are lots of tips - particularly re watering. They do love lots!

They also like some mulch too. They don't seem to appreciate being "pushed" too hard with fertilisers and are slow growing (so won't need over-feeding anyway) Just stick to seasol and blood and bone.
They also seem to prefer a slightly acid pH 5.5 to 6.5. I have found mine are happier since I brought them down in pH.

Have u checked your soil pH there? VIP!

(I used to live in Dianella - I had heaps of trouble with water repellant sand :( There is also a good thread on WA Sands here too)

Have fun!

Time: 31st January 2012 6:42pm

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nick giancola says...
Hi fellow Sand gropers.
We are in gods own country as far as being able to grow most tropical fruit trees here in the coastal belt.
I have a 7 yo Jaboticaba in a large pot that should start to produce these sweet beries with in 1 to 2 years for sale contact nick.giancola@ceramictilescentre.com.au

Time: 31st January 2012 9:48pm

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nick giancola says...
Hi fellow Sand gropers.
We are in gods own country as far as being able to grow most tropical fruit trees here in the coastal belt.
I have a 7 yo Jaboticaba in a large pot that should start to produce these sweet beries with in 1 to 2 years for sale contact nick.giancola@ceramictilescentre.com.au

Time: 31st January 2012 9:48pm

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amanda says...
Can't buy your Jaboticaba Nick :( but I reckon "gods own country" for growing may be around Byron Bay myself..? :)

But - u have to be a "God" to be able to afford land there..sigh.. ;D


Time: 1st February 2012 1:41am

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Gus says...
How big is it Nick?

Got any pics?

Time: 1st February 2012 10:49am

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nick giancola says...
Hi Gus
Its just over 6 foot. Trunk about 1 an 1/4" thick. I will take a pic tonight and post it tommorrow.

Time: 1st February 2012 5:12pm

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kim says...
Amanda - i'm happy to report my newly planted jaboticabas seem very happy indeed (new growth everywhere). i have read the this read from top to bottom so have given them heaps of water and have mulched them quite generously. now begins the wait for fruit. hehehehe

I have had a closer look at the two newer trees and can see some really thin looking roots starting to poke out the bottom of the pot - how much longer can i leave them in there (i'm still pondering whether to plant them out or repot into bigger pots)?

Time: 8th February 2012 1:20am

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amanda says...
Hi kim, that's great news - well done! :) Also handy info for those of us with sandy soil too.
The 2 in pots should be ok while u decide. I wouldn't leave them 6 months or anything - but a month or so won't make a huge difference.

You may just need to tease the roots out if they have started to curl around the pot (or cut thru with a sharp stanley knife or such) so that they don't self-strangulate.

They don't seem to have a full on vigorous root system like a mangoe or such.

Gook Luck with your new plants! :)

Time: 8th February 2012 9:36am

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kim says...
Thanks Amanda. :) I will wait to plant out the newer trees as you suggested originally. I have keep up with the water and the ones in to pots seems to be putting out a bit of new growth, so very exciting! :)

Time: 9th February 2012 11:28pm

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amanda says...
hey kim...if u are going to put them in the ground - then go for it :) U have done a great job with the others through some pretty hot weather?

As they are sub-tropicals - maybe they are enjoying the warm weather!? :D
They hated summer up here, so that's why I was a bit worried.

They have likely been grown well then? Out in full sun maybe?

Time: 10th February 2012 10:08am

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kim says...
at the nursery there were two lots - one in full sun and one under filtered sun, we did pick our plants from the full sun lot as they had been exposed to our very warm summer and excepting for the few burned tips on the leaves they were still quite healthy looking - that as well as the fact they did look a bit bigger in size! :)

at the planting site, we did as instructed by the nursery staff by putting a large amount of potting mix in the ground prior to planting, so i think they're happy because the roots haven't gotten to the sand as yet - do you think they will be ok when that happens? i'm just a bit paranoid now - wished we had put more potting mix in to give them a better home. :)

Time: 12th February 2012 4:36pm

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amanda says...
Hi Kim, they should be fine. U will need to add quality manure and top up mulch etc, as time passes - good worm activity will help mix it it around.

Most of the feeder roots are closer to the surface that we realise :)

In the tree sacks of my 4 plants I have a thivk layer of quite a mixed mulch of pine bark chips, leaf litter and sphagnum moss. The plants are really happy now.
Maybe they are like lychees...as Mike mentioned that they seem to like a bit of a mix in their mulch too..

Time: 13th February 2012 8:17pm

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Doug says...
That tip on blood and bone was fantastic.
This is the third crop since the start of summer, about a dozen just getting to the ripe black colour and perhaps 2 dozen at the pea size.
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1

Time: 15th February 2012 4:39pm

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kim says...
Hi Amanda, sadly, we don't have any worm activity at all - not yet. We got some from our neighbour but i don't think any managed to survive (haven't seen them at all when i got curious and started digging a bit to check). But hopefully with time we will get some... :)

Doug - how old is your tree? i'm envious - can't wait for the day when i'll get to sample this fruit.

With the blood and bone - do you apply it year round?




Time: 16th February 2012 6:34pm

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amanda says...
Nice fruit Doug! Well done...how do your jab's handle winter in Melb? Any problems?

kim, yes u can apply the b&b year round...the plants grow slowly thru winter also.
I feed mine every month or two (usually every two months as I am a bit more wary as they are in pots) and also give them seasol every month.

You can always start a worm farm and use the extras to innoculate your soil... :)

Time: 17th February 2012 4:59pm

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kim says...
Hi Amanda,

Worms farms/compost bins are on my wish list at the moment. We're in the process of giving our garden a makeover of sort, so once done, I will be shopping. :)

Is it safe to give blood and bone at the same time as the seasol? i'm such a scatterbrain that i'll probably forget if i don't do it at the same time. :p

Time: 18th February 2012 1:26am

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amanda says...
yes it's safe kim :)

Time: 18th February 2012 12:58pm

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Doug says...
Hi Amanda and Kim
No problems so far. I am growing all the sub-tropicals in 45cm diameter tubs on the back concrete patio which is against a north-facing brick wall with laserlite (90% penetration) roofing. The really hot dry summer days have been more of a problem, but we haven't had a summer this year here in Melbourne. The jab is 6 or 7 years old and I tip prune it to about a metre in diameter. Once winter comes I move everything back close to the wall, but this summer's banana purchases from the local Bunnings are already close to the roof, so I don't know what I will do with them. I can't believe the number of people in the vicinity that are successfully growing bananas to maturity.

Time: 21st February 2012 2:36pm

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BJ says...
Does anyone have vextator seeds or plants for sale? I've got a nice spot for one, and I'd love to find one, as we cant import any seeds because of the rust situation (which has already taken my excellent cedar bay cherry anyways).

Time: 26th February 2012 9:29pm

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micarle says...
Bj i doubt there is many of these in aus! I've been looking for one for ages... There always seems to be seed for sale in usa, but yeah its hard to find a sourse from non guava rust country's. I'll let you know if i come across any.

Time: 27th February 2012 5:48am

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BJ says...
Recher says he has it above. I know there must be a source somewhere here, as the much rarer M. aureana and a few of the rare plinia are here.

Time: 27th February 2012 9:44am

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kim says...
Please help - I've noticed the new leaves on some of my jabos have gone yellow - is this normal?

also, i think i was a bit eager with the last application of blood and bone because even the new leaves have burnt tips... will they be ok?

Time: 9th April 2012 2:33am

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amanda says...
Hi kim...fussy things aren't they? They sure don't like to be pushed too hard with fertilisers. I would give them a really thorough soaking with the hose.

Jab's love their water and as someone mentions - they come from a place that floods. This is handy for you - as you can give them a good flush that they will love - and also flush off some of those extra nutrients...

Apart from replacing the soil (a bit drastic) that's all you can do really.



Time: 9th April 2012 10:31am

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kim says...
Hey Amanda

i was watering them daily until a couple of weeks ago - i'd thought the burnt tips would disappear, but they haven't. The new leaves come out nicely, but they too go on to develop the burnt tips.... hopefully things will improve with the cooler weather??

Time: 9th April 2012 2:20pm

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amanda says...
Can you post a pic of a close shot of these leaves and also the bushes kim?

It would be worth us all having a look at the type of yellowing and the pattern of burning perhaps...


Time: 9th April 2012 2:46pm

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kim says...
Hi Amanda

here are the pics - what do you think i'm doing wrong? :)

thanks.
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1
Picture: 2

Time: 11th April 2012 7:51pm

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amanda says...
Hi kim...they are starting to look like mine used too :-(

Are u using bore water or tap water?
Were they in full sun all day in summer?

Can't remember now - did you do a pH test?

(in the meantime - keep the water going to them (ie: keep the ground "moist") until the rains arrive...) Have you got any rain water..?

Time: 11th April 2012 9:37pm

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kim says...
They're getting tap water as well as my bubs' bath water. Sadly no rain water at the moment - I'm hoping to buy a rain barrel when i can spare the cash.. :)

pH was approx 6.7 last time we checked. I have been giving my trees a lot of the used coffee grounds, so hopefully this has helped lower the pH somewhat (??).

Time: 15th April 2012 1:41am

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amanda says...
Hi kim...cut the baby bathwater asap - if u are adding anything, at all, to it..?
When you water them try to give them a good deep soaking every 2 days (rather than shallow watering daily - this is not good) ...this will help to wash any 'salts' out past the drip line and down past the root ball.
You are safe to drench them :)

Keep watering them well past the first rains...the first rains can often push salts back into the drip line, as they are not sufficient to flush.

I don't know what the quality of your tap water might be - you would need to get it tested to know for certain.
I had mine tested here - it cost $60 and I picked up the kit from an Irrigation shop. It was well worth it.
Our tap water is very salty and very hard also :-(

I can't water my jaboticabas with our tap water...(nor loquats) as it causes leaf burning. I strongly suspect our intense summer sun (Perth incl) directly on the plants all day - is far too much for these plants also. They need more shade - but just my experience so far.

Other folk have mentioned the "yellows" on these plants, in relation to sun, also (in this thread maybe?)

Luckily I have 50,000L rainwater tank and use rainwater only now - no leaf burning at all.

I can't be sure that is your problem - but it wouldn't surprise me - especially given that Perth's water supply is diminishing - without good rains to recharge the aquifiers it might be possible that the scheme water is saltier than usual.

Anyway - if you see an improvement in the new growth in spring (or well into our rainy season) then it's likely the tap water.

Here is a pic of mine at their worst - before I dug them up - they had been in the ground 2 or 3 yrs at this stage and were just slowly getting worse - despite my best efforts.

The other pic is them now - with only rainwater, a little blood and bone and in a shade house...
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1
Picture: 2

Time: 16th April 2012 11:59am

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kim says...
wow Amanda, what a difference between those two pics!! hope my trees will one day look just as healthy as yours... fingers crossed.

the only thing i use is Aveeno for bubs, so nothing too damaging...? i also use this water on my blueberries and half are pushing lots of new growth while the other half are looking a little sad.. don't know why?? i'll probably try adding some vinegar to the bath water and see if that helps a bit - what do you think?

thanks for the advice re the deep watering - i've started to do so, now to wait and see if things will improve... there's always some new growth on my jabos, so maybe things are not quite that bad...??? some newer growth looks quite healthy-ish, some leaves are full sized with no sign of burn on the tips/edges... gives me hope that things are getting better.

Time: 22nd April 2012 2:28am

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perth
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MaryT says...
Hi kim - Any growth on the jaboticaba is great good news; I 've had one for years and every new leaf was a celebration :) I gave it away recently to friends who live in a rainforest further north. I hope it'll do better there.

Time: 22nd April 2012 7:11am

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amanda says...
Hi Kim...they do grow quite slowly - but when they are happy they seem to pick up the pace quite noticably. Personally - I wouldn't use any grey water on them at all, it's not worth any damage to them.
Different plants have different tolerances to salts etc..bluberries are a very different kettle of fish..(there is a huge thread on blueberries - maybe post a pic there of your sick ones?)

Even if my jab's get too dry in their tree sacks they then develop marginal leaf burn (only a little) they are very touchy.





Time: 22nd April 2012 10:43am

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denise says...
I have imported seeds of a hybrid jaboticaba from Fruitlovers in Hawaii. The leaves are larger and the growth much faster. Worth trying.

Time: 22nd April 2012 11:38am

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BJ says...
Hi Denise,
I'd love to get those seeds from Oscar, but i dont think we can get them with restrictions from myrtle rust outbreaks causing the rather knee jerk reaction of stopping myrtaceous seeds entering the country. Are you in nz? Those are the hybrid red jabots that can fruit in 2-3years, arent they?

Time: 22nd April 2012 12:28pm

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Gus says...
Interesting Denise.
Do you have any seeds you would like to sell?
Otherwise I will buy some off their website.
Was there anything else worth but=ying from them.
I think postage is like $40, but I assume that if you buy a whole bunch of seeds it probably upsets customs.


Time: 22nd April 2012 12:32pm

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Mike says...
Denise,I wonder if it is the same as my large leafed one.Are the fruit larger,more brown than black and have a fine fuzz? My one grows a bit slower than the standard and was also slower to fruit for the first time.

Time: 22nd April 2012 12:32pm

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Gus says...
I wonder how all the Jabs compare.
Regular, yellow, large leafed and hybrid. Worth having all?

Time: 22nd April 2012 12:55pm

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Mike says...
The regular ones are pretty good and super productive.My large leafed one fruited just once and they were excellent with a different but similar flavour.My yellows refuse to set fruit as I may be too warm but my brother's one did and he said they were tangy and nice but totally different in taste.He said they were almost as good by his taste.

Time: 22nd April 2012 1:03pm

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Gus says...
Would you say the large leafed were better than small leafed?

Time: 22nd April 2012 1:24pm

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BJ says...
There are lots of different jaboticabas. Denise's I believe is the 'red' hybrid. Slightly smaller reddish brown fruit. All have similar taste except for the really different species - yellow jab, white jab, blue jab etc. The main feature of the hybrid is that it supposedly fruits in 1/4 of the time it would take the other true jabs.

Time: 22nd April 2012 1:25pm

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About the Author Theposterformerlyknownas
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Gus says...
I wonder why the hybrids aren't available here?
When a tree takes so long to fruit you would assume that the shops would go straight for the hybrids and forget about the regualar trees if the fruit are almost the same.
I just bought another regular small leaf that is about 6'5".
I am hoping such a a large tree may fruit a little sooner.

Time: 22nd April 2012 5:27pm

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Mike says...
Gus it is frustrating that with so many fruit types only the poorer and older types are available in Australia.It has me baffled why this is the case and why people don't bring in the good types and make a killing.I am not saying that is the case with jaboticabas.
About 18 years ago there were a number of large, old jaboticabas of both large and small leafed types.I always filled a bucket with fruiut of the large leafed in preference and I don't recall why I preferred them at the time.

Time: 22nd April 2012 5:40pm

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Gus says...
I am surprised that so few people have even heard of this fruit. They are clearly popular amongst those who have tried them.
Do you see a lot of them in Cairns?

Time: 22nd April 2012 5:59pm

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Mike says...
In spite of many of the tropical fruits being around for decades those like jaboticabas,rambutans,jackfruit and mangosteen are pretty rare.Most yards have no natives or fruit trees but palms like golden cane,ixoras,yellow allanda,hibiscus,frangipani and mother-in-law tongues are popular.
Many older folk have vegie gardens and old time fruit trees like citrus,carambola,granadilla,paw paws,passionfruit,mangoes and sugar apples.The population has tripled to about 150 000 in 25 years or so and most people come from Briz,Sydney,Melbourne and Adelaide so might be less familiar with growing tropical fruit.People sure buy lots of tropical fruit at the markets.

Time: 22nd April 2012 6:16pm

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amanda says...
So true Mike...but I also find it amazing when a very young checkout operator has to ask me what the english spinach is...?? :-O
Lol..god knows what they'd make of jaboticaba..!? ;-)

I also wonder if people have been dissapointed by their initial impressions of some tropical fruits...especially as you mention that many of our varieties can be sub-standard?

It can do a lot of damage to a fruits reputation when folk just poke seeds in a pot so they can make a buck at the markets selling the plants (and/or the fruit) do u think..?

I am having maybe my 6th go at Durian....(just to make sure that I have tried different types) before I decide it's not for me...I can see why others really like it though (I can't handle that underlying "onion" flavour I keep getting..? anyway - off topic there)

Not all rambutans are great either...I could take or leave them to be honest - in favour of lychee (which is pretty reliably a good fruit..) especially if I am paying up to $20/kilo.

The other factor, for me at least, is the wastage...Thai mangosteen are $18/kg here at present - I could afford to buy a kg as a special treat - but I won't because I know at least half a kg will be wasted pith. Gorgeous fruit but not worth it (and they likely imported that fruit for $3/kilo...grrr..)

Marketing is a very crucial part of getting unusual fruits up and running...but it has to be backed by quality also.

A bit all over the place there - but just thinking about the many different factors that come into play.

I suspect dragon fruit and white sapote will take off (over here at least) as the first significant amount of fruits that have come onto the market are great quality - a big start. Still too expensive for everyday folk though (but I remember when avocados were a luxury too! :)

Getting them recognised and enjoyed will then lead to people growing them at home (just like with avocados..) ?




Time: 22nd April 2012 6:49pm

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Mike says...
Don't get me started Amanda but how many people have sworn off paw paw,white sapote,dragon fruit and sapodillas because they had the common poor quality types.People have been shocked at the lovely flavour of good ones I have offered them.The same could be said for jackfruit,lychees,rambutans,passionfruit and many others.Avocadoes have an unconventional taste and took a long time to be accepted and they vary a bit in quality also.Durian is complex and unconventional and a fresh good quality one doesn't need a 'cultured palate' to be enjoyed.There may be a hint of nutty,vanilla and onion custard but not onion flavour in some.

Time: 22nd April 2012 7:13pm

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amanda says...
It's fun testing some of our home grown fruits on visitors isn't it!? :) It blows me away how many folk love our Kaffir plums tho..? Sour is appreciated more often than I realised!? (I like sour too...) My 8yr eats a whole bowl of them at a time...(better than those sour lollies she reckons!?)

My introduction to tropical fruits has only been through holidays in Asia, to be honest. There wasn't much about at Rusty's back when I lived there..? Lots of lovely weird leafy greens tho! Now I know them as Gai Lan, Pak Choy, perennial coriander etc...hehe... ;)

We have also been very spoilt with cheap and plentiful fruit n veg for two generations now...why bother growing their own? People seem to have other priorities these days. In my grandparents days - it was about survival.

I have always loved gardening and veg growing - but fruit tree growing and being interested in selections has come at my middle-age...but maybe that is because I have not owned my own land until now..?

Renting is big handbrake on growing fruit trees, for many people, I feel?

Just some thoughts. I would love to see folk become more interested in the provenance of their fruit. An incredible amount of work goes into breeding, selecting and then getting this produce to market in lovely condition.

Time: 22nd April 2012 7:50pm

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Gus says...
What fruit do you guys think is the biggest surprise to visitors?

Time: 22nd April 2012 7:54pm

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Mike says...
That is all true Amanda and I am surprised at how many people enjoy my bilimbis.People seem very interested in growing their own food once they get introduced to it.
I think for some of us there is something innate that drives us to grow plants for food,keep animals and even go fishing.It isn't so much about need or saving money but it is the only and natural thing to do.Not everyone is like this.

Time: 22nd April 2012 7:59pm

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John Mc says...
My Phalsa has an aftertaste resembling oysters. I don't know if there are wide variances in quality but mine starts off quite astringent them fades to oysters.
Unfortunately for us down south frozen Durian is our only option, hence the bottom of the barrel, last of the pick strong onion flavours and I still go back for more.

Time: 22nd April 2012 8:07pm

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amanda says...
Lol...that's funny John Mc..I keep going back too!? The creaminess of it is addictive somehow? I have only ever had frozen Durian :-(

One day I hope to do a kind of gardening/fruit trip in Asia (sans brown thumb hubby... lol) like those "culinary" tours of Italy etc...? :D

Maybe this could be a great business venture for someone like Rev - who is now based in Java...? Hmnnn..

Time: 22nd April 2012 8:26pm

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amanda says...
Dunno about the best Gus...I can't grow all things. But - people have almost never tried Acerola fruit - so when they try mine- 100% have really liked them.

Such a shame they have a small flesh to seed ratio - if they could be grown bigger (like many fruit I guess) they would be a winner 4 sure. I wouldn;t bother growing them other than for the novelty value.

Time: 22nd April 2012 8:30pm

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Gus says...
My Grandpa in Scotland used to grow great raspberries. Never been happy with a raspberry since.
I had never heard of feijoas until I visited my cousin in New Zealand.
I couldn't beleive the flavour.
Agree with the Acerola. I like the tree and the flavour but they have a very poor ratio.

Time: 22nd April 2012 8:48pm

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Mike says...
Gus most people don't like to try new fruit but it depends on the person.A simple red paw paw,abiu,gold pineapple,good SE Asian mango or good lychee seem to get positive reactions and surprises if people haven't tried them or had good ones before.
Considering few enjoy durian at first it is surprising it is probably the most eagerly sought and revered of all fruit.

Time: 22nd April 2012 8:54pm

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John Mc says...
re the Acerola Amanda, I beg to differ. Mine has a comfortable flesh to seed ratio and I wouldn't say excellent, but a subtle sweet flavour. It's been in a constant state of flower since it started which makes it an excellent producer. I bought a labelled Florida sweet from Daley's recently as a control so I'll know how my seedlings (cuttings?)compare with the named var. The Florida sweet probably won't bear fruit for at least another year so I'm waiting in anticipation.
Oh, and they grow by cutting very easy.

Time: 22nd April 2012 9:14pm

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kim says...
Hi

MaryT - very true, i'm always smiling from ear to ear when i spot any new growth. Why did you give your tree away? lucky friend.. :)

Amanda - grey water will now go to the blueberries and tap water to the jabos. :) I did think to post a pic of the sickly blueberries, but because there is a some small growth, i'm waiting to see if the plants start improving first before wasting everyone's time.. . ;D



Time: 23rd April 2012 12:43am

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perth
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MaryT says...
Kim I gave my jaboticaba away because I have limited space so it was in a pot and although it was quite healthy, never flowered or fruited or put on much growth. My friends were delighted to receive it and will care for it and help it thrive. Best of all they'll be able to put it in the ground and allow it to fullfil its full potential. It was a win-win.

Time: 23rd April 2012 7:09am

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BJ says...
I give my jabs the baby bath water and they love it. I've cut right back on the amount of baby products used in the bath (most are full of sodium based substances) and fertilise the jabs regularly as the amount of water going onto them can flush the goodness out of the soil. Its also a good idea to give them a good frweshwater soak every so often to try to stop the build up of any nasties in the soil.

I've never been impressed by Acerola, especially when compared to grumixama or jaboticaba, panama berry, cherry of the rio grande, pitomba, even black brazilian cherries. So much so that mine went from a prime spot in the yard to the back corner, and only hangs in there for its supposed healh benefits. On the upside they transplant as easily as any tree I've known in mid summer and are near impossible to kill.

Time: 23rd April 2012 8:52am

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Gus says...
Hey B.J

I don't mean to be oppurtunistic, but if you have any seeds of the "cherry of the rio Grande" that would like to sell you have a customer here.
Cheers

Time: 23rd April 2012 10:37am

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amanda says...
BJ...your soil and climate are very different to kims...I would even be certain that your scheme water would be superior to Perths also.

Kims trees are suffering (see her pic)and she will eventually lose them if she doesn't take steps to rectify the problem.
I wonder what the pH of the wash product is also...? Sandy soils do not have the buffering capacity that loams and clays have, we also don't get the wonderful flushing rains that you have.

kim, I garden in the same climate and sands as you - and u can see from what happened to my trees the damage that can be done.
How much did these trees cost you?

One of the next things that would be good for you to do is a few pH tests...try several spots and depths around the plants and get a 'feel' for what the pH is.
You need it to be on the acidic side..

It's worth doing this as you have imported the soil..?

One step at a time :)

Time: 23rd April 2012 11:18am

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amanda says...
Kim...I looked up water quality test results for your area but could only find 09/10 results which were so-so.
(eg: your Average pH is 7.8 which is slightly alkaline and a bit different to what you tested?)

I would suggest contacting the Water Corp and asking them to direct you to the MOST recent Quality test results for your area (the summer results are really the important one's to you)

(If you "complain" about your water they may also do a "spot test" at your street (they did for me when I complained about our independent test results being over WHO limits).. ;-)

The water corp can supply anyone this information at any time guys...it's no drama and is part of their Quality Assurance to you, the customer, so don't be afraid to ask, especially if you are having problems with your plants despite your best efforts...

The next best thing you can do is shore up some rainwater for next summer - so that you can flush your Jab's from time to time with non-salty water.

Post the water quality test results here if u get them? I will be happy to have a basic look for you.. :)

I wonder if anyone else is having the same problems with their Jaboticabas in Perth...?

Gardening with possible marginal water in our sands requires making some adjustments to the normal practices. Fertilising methods will be one of the biggest issues.

I guess this will affect many WA folk in time - as our climate is drying and heating up...and we are not receiving the rainfall to replenish dams and aquifiers...and thus dilute out the 'nasties'...

Certainly this scenario has happened here already in the Mid West...with no other possible sources of less saline water to be found...we are stuck with what we have from underground only. It's only a matter time b4 a desalination plant will have be used - jsut to make this water drinkable (let alone for the luxury of watering my plants...)



Time: 23rd April 2012 2:33pm

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amanda says...
Hey...does anyone know if Jaboticabas form mycorrhizial associations with their roots?
Have asked around but can't seem to find a definitive answer - and I am now curious about this in my tree sacks...(pic)

I transplanted all of my sub tropicals from my orchards and into the same soil mix in their tree sacks.

Only the four Jaboticabas have developed this fungus...no other plants have. All 15 mixed trees are treated exactly the same.

I have tried to "introduce" it into the other tree sacks and had no luck so far - it hasn't grown in them at all.

I am curious because my Jabs are so healthy now...apart from adjustments I have made to their watering etc..I am also wondering if this fungus could be a part of the success...? (as it could be feeding the trees as beneficial fungi do..?)

Looking ahead I was thinking that maybe it might help to innoculate new plantings in Perth to help get them going..?

Mike - have you seen anything like this in the root zone of Jab's maybe?


Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1

Time: 23rd April 2012 5:08pm

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Mike says...
Amanda I have not seen anything published on the association in jabs in particular but would be shocked if they had no such symbiotic arrangement.Nearly all trees do but with some annuals and entire groups like brassica there is no association.Truffles are another root fungus group that don't get much air time.Mycorrhizae help fight bad fungi including phytophthora and they are really important to some trees like Nepheliums/lychees.

Time: 23rd April 2012 6:32pm

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Mike says...
I looked at that picture and I have seen similar cottony fungi in breaking down mulch.Most of the time it is ok and just decomposers but I wouldn't welcome it.You probably already have mycorrhizae in the roots.I would scoop it out but the mycelia could be right through it.I wonder if clay could get rid of it?

Time: 23rd April 2012 6:38pm

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amanda says...
It's been in there for nearly 2yrs now Mike - the only problem it can cause is water repellancy if the sack dries out. Speedy and Rev mentioned it could be feeding on the woody material in the mix (so I'd better keep feeding it carbon maybe.. :)
I am going to leave it there (no hope of getting rid of it anyway..) the plants are so happy now (see my pics above on 16th April)
Maybe when I put them back into the ground things may change tho.

The only way I can really find out for certain is to get a root section under the microscope (might do this)



Time: 23rd April 2012 7:36pm

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Mike says...
Amanda they'll be correct I'd say and it does look like what you'd see in woodchip and surface woody mulch.It must be pretty coarse and right through for it to last so long.I suppose if the plants are ok then it is best not to mess with them too much.

Time: 23rd April 2012 7:54pm

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amanda says...
kim..in addition to the above (sorry - don't want to overload you..) Jab's like a soil pH of 5.5-6.5 (which is not far above gardenias... ;)

This is a interesting reference as the climate issues and soil salinity may be similar to ours in WA...they also recommend afternoon shade for Jab's (and I agree - for Perth and north)

http://www.phoenixtropicals.com/jaboticaba.html




Time: 23rd April 2012 7:54pm

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Mike says...
Phoenix might not be a good comparason as it is more like Alice Springs but a little drier,hotter in Summer and colder in Winter.They like full sun in the tropics in spite of very high UV, but the higher humidity is also to their liking.

Time: 23rd April 2012 8:13pm

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amanda says...
Maybe Mike....but if you check out the pics of kims plants and my plants you will see the exact same pattern developing. Tell me I am wrong?

No offence but Brisbane and Cairns have very little in common with Perth. It's crazy to try and compare the Brisbane or Cairns climate, weather and soil to kim's in Perth.
Crikey - you likely get less "daylight hours" just with your increased cloud cover...

What do you think kim should do?

Time: 23rd April 2012 8:23pm

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Mike says...
I didn't look at kim's plants before and there are similarities.I think surrounding an acid preferring plant with alkali concrete could cause nutrient problems like the P,mg and some trace element balances.
The climates are certainly very different especially in terms of UV,humidity and seasonality.Sometimes sunburn or nutrients deficiencies can be spotted in spite of those differences.Soils can be like that as well with sandy soils or heavy clays having similar challenges wherever they are.

Time: 23rd April 2012 8:42pm

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Mike says...
Oh yeah Kim could always throw a bit of sulphur around and load it with mulch.The concrete on both sides might give it a hard life if it stays put.

Time: 23rd April 2012 8:44pm

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About the Author Mike30
Cairns
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BJ says...
If my climate were comparable to Phoenix, where I have spent a bit of time living with family, there is no way I'd even consider growing water loving plants like jaboticaba. Perhaps replacing them with pommegranates is the responsible thing to do. They make very handsome fruiting street trees and road island planitings in Phoenix.

My comments about using baby bath water above were advising that it is fine to do under normal conditions. Your conditions are not what I would consider normal for a Jaboticaba. This is, after all, the Jaboticaba thread, not the growing Jaboticaba in Perth and Phoenix thread...

Gus, the tree has stopped producing now, but if you are still interested next season I could easily post you some seed.

Time: 24th April 2012 8:57am

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About the Author Theposterformerlyknownas
Brisbane
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amanda says...
You could be right BJ - but as there are no other WA folk here who seem to be able to help then I guess Jab growing here must be fairly new....? (or everyones plants have died because they can't survive here..oops)

There are subtle differences to caring for most plants in this climate...but to have to start a new thread just to deal with those issues seems a bit extreme...?

Anyway - I'm sorry if I offended you. It was also a bit confusing as you stated they hated the bath water further up in this thread..? It seemed very risky for kim with newly planted trees that are already showing signs of salt and pH stress.

Time: 24th April 2012 10:22am

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About the Author amanda19
Gerladton. 400km north of Perth
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BJ says...
I've been trying to work out why my jabs now love the bath water. In their former spot they were in a better drained position. Thier new spot, formerly that of my acreola, is constantly moist and sometimes quite wet for days/weeks. They are constantly putting out new growth now (I say they because I have basically duo planted a small and large leaved jab for fun). I guess they enjoy the added moisture and can deal with the salt better if its spread through a more moist envirnment. I've also cut down product use in the bath, which would go a huge way to helping.

If I were to grow jabs in Perth, or anywhere particularly challenging, I'd look at getting a big pot with few drainage holes, putting a big saucer under the bottom and putting some clay loam or dirt in the bottom of the pot to slow drainage even more. They love water. One person on anotehr forum even grew a young plant totally submerged for one month and it was quite happy.

Time: 24th April 2012 10:45am

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About the Author Theposterformerlyknownas
Brisbane
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amanda says...
I agree BJ...if my tree sacks get too dry I get slight margin burning straight off...!? I use a very thick mulch of spagnum moss now (with leaves and very small twigs also) they seem to like this and the moss holds moisture and likely increases humidity for them?

They have shallow roots (like a passionfruit I reckon?) that also appreciate not drying out at all kim...

They do need to be kept moist at all times I realise now...this would also stop any salts from re-entering the plant.

They may be more suited to our S-West climates in the long run I am thinking. Unless they can be kept shaded - and they are not a plant than can be plonked in any old soil...it needs to be an advanced, very organic loam..?
(just my gut feeling from watching my guys change...)

Time: 24th April 2012 10:56am

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About the Author amanda19
Gerladton. 400km north of Perth
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kim says...
I think that's very generous of you MaryT. :) I'm sure when it does fruit, you'll be one of the first to sample - i really hope it does taste like mangosteen (my favourite fruit). How old was your tree? I've got two in pots that's about 6 or 7 years old when purchased a few months ago, so i'm really hoping for fruits sometime in the near future. I've read that its possible, so i'm hoping mine will too. :D

Amanda, I will definitely be re-testing the pH level in the soil, just been a bit tied up with a sick toddler. And thank you for the tip about contacting the Water Corp - i thought of that, but felt like i might've been wasting their time... :p I'll prob be calling them in the next couple of days as i'm curious to know as well..

Wow - i'm still reading all your input even as i'm typing up my response - you're a wealth of information Amanda. Greatly appreciated - thank you for sharing! :)

I know what you mean about jabos loving acidity, i hope i've done enough for my two in pots (repotted yesterday) by adding about 30% peat moss. i've also mulched with a thin layer of spaghnum moss. I'll continue to give them used coffee grounds whenever i get any... do you think this is enough for them to be happy?

Mike - only one side is concrete, we've put some bricks to make a sort of border to try and stop the grass from creeping over and strangling my trees. They're mulched heavily with some tree clippings. I'm a bit of a newbie so a bit scared of the more involved aspect of gardening... eg. using sulphur.. I do give them a dose of vinegar water every now and then to try and keep things acidic.



Time: 30th April 2012 2:32am

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About the Author kim14
perth
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MaryT says...
kim it is not generosity, just necessity :) My place is too small for all the plants I have and keep acquiring. Anyway these friends helped me find cuttings for someone on the forum who gave me his Daleys voucher about to expire so the favours are going around and around. Believe me I profit more than I lose. Mike and others on the forum have given me heaps of stuff. He also encourages me to make room for more viable and productive plants. And yes, I expect to see some jaboticaba if that tree ever fruits. I've had it for a couple of years. By the way for acid loving plants try giving them coffee grinds; your local coffee shop would be happy to give you bags of it.

Time: 30th April 2012 7:36am

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About the Author MaryT
Sydney
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amanda says...
Lets hope this rain is helping them along kim - we should see how they look after some really good rain-soakings? :)
(I have been lucky to have some great people, on this Forum, help me (and teach me too :) so what goes around - comes around kim ;)

I haven't tried coffee grounds myself..but MaryT knows her stuff - so it seems to be ok..?
Down the track your pH readings will let you know.
I don't use Ag sulphur either...I have some but I try not to be that drastic - sands can be a bit touchy with chem fert's etc.
I use pine bark chips (or pine needles better if u can get some?) to help keep my pH down - it's more long term and more gentle on the soil.

Time: 30th April 2012 1:21pm

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About the Author amanda19
Geraldton. 400km north of Perth.
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VF says...
Amanda, going back a few weeks ago you were wondering about fungus on your Jabs roots - was reading a book today on local plants and found a mention that "Myrtaceae" (amongst others) "have symbiotic fungi on their roots which enhance nutrient uptake". (from "Wild plants of Greater Brisbane- a Qld Museum Guide". page 304) I would assume this is probably true for all Myrtaceae, not just indigenous plants, but I may be wrong! Hope this helps.

Time: 1st May 2012 5:54pm

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About the Author VF
Wongawallan
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amanda says...
Hey VF - thanks for passing this info on :) I am very interested to know this!


Time: 1st May 2012 6:46pm

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About the Author amanda19
Geraldton. 400km north of Perth.
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Mike says...
Amanda,this is how I trim my tree to get access to the fruit.
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1

Time: 5th May 2012 5:01pm

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About the Author
Cairns
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amanda says...
What a beautiful tree Mike. It's loving it in the tropics hey? Just as well u cut it that way - you would have no hope otherwise!?
I so hope mine do ok when we get down south.
There is no frost where we are going but it can get down 3 and 4 degrees C o/night in winter...
(Heaps more rain though! (hooray!) and soil + water a lot better)

Does yours have any dramas with mildews or fungus in the tropics and being so dense..?

Time: 5th May 2012 7:48pm

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About the Author amanda19
Geraldton. 400km north of Perth.
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John Mc says...
That's an excellent idea Mike, I must keep it in mind when/if mine ever gets that large. Is that a dwarf Amberella on the right?
Nice to see some of your trees, keep the pics comming, hey? give that new camera a workout.

Time: 5th May 2012 7:58pm

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About the Author JohnMc1
Warnervale NSW
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snottiegobble says...
Not meant for us humans to eat are they, Mike? Amanda, I had one in SW Vic. It survived the frosts, but so slow in growth I often forgot where it was! it grew about 12 cm a year so no good for an old bloke!

Time: 5th May 2012 8:04pm

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About the Author snottiegobble
Bunbury/Busso
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